S2, E19: How Tom Wallisch Changed Freeskiing Forever

A lot of people see the highlight clip and assume the rest is luck. Tom Wallisch doesn’t. From lapping small hills outside Pittsburgh to becoming one of the defining names in modern freestyle skiing, Tom breaks down the unglamorous parts that made the glamorous moments possible: repetition, confidence built from community, and learning how to evolve when the sport evolves.

We talk about the early Newschoolers and YouTube era, when a one minute edit and a comment section could change your entire trajectory. Tom explains how style trends like the Park City tall tee wave weren’t random, they were a choice to stand out, then a willingness to own the lane when people started paying attention. From there, we get into the real shift from filming to high level slopestyle and big air competition, what sponsors expect, and how even small things like picking up poles can be the difference between being “different” and being scored fairly.

The conversation goes deeper into longevity: the mindset behind progression, the story of building and hitting a Guinness verified world record rail, and why film segments often outlive medals in your memory. Tom also shares how he transitioned into ski film production and creative ownership with Good Company, and how announcing at X Games and the Olympics became a way to keep freeskiing accessible and respected for new audiences.

If you care about freeskiing, terrain park culture, X Games history, Olympic skiing, or how athletes navigate an action sports career transition, this one is packed with lessons you can actually use. Subscribe, share this with a friend who loves the mountains, and leave a review with your favorite moment or question you want us to dig into next.

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Transcript

Getting Comfortable On Mic

SPEAKER_03 0:30

This is the job. Everybody playing the channel weekend.

SPEAKER_05 0:37

Steel jump is the real season in September. My camera security is telling me like you should be in X games, you should do this, you should do that. The feedback was the absolute fuel. I'm gonna move a lot. Who are we kidding?

SPEAKER_03 1:07

I'll keep it close. I might move things as you do, but not the first time and not the last. I tend to talk a lot with my hands.

SPEAKER_05 1:14

Shh, I mean having trouble. It's the beauty of what do I do with my hands? What's that from?

SPEAKER_03 1:19

Um Ricky Bobby. Ricky Bobby, yeah. Yeah. I don't know what to do with my hands. I mean, story my life. Like sometimes, because I like on social media, I do a lot of like green screen talking heads about like lore history kind of things going on. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:32

And like at first I was like, I'd have like a lawfalier mic on me and I'd be like, What do I I mean that's how you you gotta when you're not talking to somebody, it's so hard not to do something with your hands. Yeah. So eventually you're presenting and exactly.

SPEAKER_03 1:47

It feels like you need to talk with your hands even though you don't. So eventually I ended up like, I kind of just want to get like a mic. Yeah, and so that I have a mic, and I'm like, because I can handle this, because I can't, yeah. It was it's funny, like it especially like when you get like it's a weird thing to get used to being like, okay, here's a camera, here's a microphone, like press post, this is fine. Yeah, and but then some people come up and they're like, How do you do this? I'm like, it doesn't even register stuff like that.

SPEAKER_05 2:15

People get like stuck a deer in the headlights when the camera are in front of a crowd. People are like, How could you ever? I'm like, I don't care what that room is doing, just put me on the stage. I I'll make them laugh, I'll talk, I don't care. It means nothing.

SPEAKER_03 2:28

Yeah, well, because you're someone who obviously is like presents a lot of things, has been a personality in a lot of different ways in skiing. Like, would you rather 10,000 people you don't know or 10 people you do know?

SPEAKER_05 2:41

Oh I mean, still 10 people I do know, I'd prefer because the inside jokes and the weird quips would really hit. Yeah, you know, 10 people you know at a bar, kill that environment. But 10,000, I think I'm not like stressed. As long as we're talking skiing. Like if I had to present like astrophysics to 10,000, it's gonna be a lot nerve-wracking. Like you had to study the material, but like talking me, talking skiing, talking sport, talking something I know, I don't care.

SPEAKER_03 3:12

Cool, yeah. I mean, that's the thing I learned in college, is like all the professors are like talking about something they know because sometimes I'm I was always like, oh my god, you're a genius.

SPEAKER_05 3:20

And then like it's so easy for them to teach every day, but it's like they've been teaching that class and that subject that matter of whatever it is for so long.

SPEAKER_03 3:29

Totally. And like my so my girlfriend's getting her PhD in chemistry up at the U right now. Jesus. I know, right? It's like we have very different lives, it's hilarious.

SPEAKER_05 3:36

Yeah, you're like, uh, I'm podcasting, babe. You're studying.

SPEAKER_03 3:40

I talked to somebody about what they do. What'd you like? I was separating atoms and molecules. I'm like, Oh my god, sure. But like I was talking to her boss, and like, well, I wasn't talking to her, she was telling me about a conversation where, like, because he's at Master's field, knows everything, but then he was talking to her about running because she's a big uh runner, trail runner, and it was like obviously like it was like, oh, like not quite there, you know? He's into it, but so that's yeah, he just like doesn't like he has the depth in the one thing, and then it doesn't really translate everywhere else, but that's life in an essence. But Tom, I'm stoked because it's been fun of being someone who's grown up in Salt Lake, especially like someone who like skiing has always been something that's been a part of my life. Like my grandpa's theory was if you can walk, you can ski. So ever since then, it was I mean, Brighton, Snowbird, Park City, Alta, and like I was always the kid who like mean I was friends with like Kai Kropella and Thane Rich and like Alex Schlope. And so, like, I was the kid who's like, Oh, cool, like I'm here to hit the jump, I might like do a three, five, seven, whatever. But they'd be like, Cool, I'm gonna do like dub time.

SPEAKER_05 4:39

I'm like, great, go have fun.

SPEAKER_03 4:40

Yeah, have fun, meet you at the rails. And but it's been fun to see how, like, in my kind of like late high school, when you and when I'm so excited to talk about it, like when you got here to like now to see how much like that Tom Walsh has transformed.

SPEAKER_05 4:55

Crazy.

SPEAKER_03 4:56

And especially talking with some people.

SPEAKER_05 4:58

I know, been out here 20 years. I just realized that's crazy.

SPEAKER_03 5:02

Oh six to twenty-six, and it's like it's always like those time frames of when you go tell someone a story of like, oh, like driving past Kenswick, oh, I used to live there 20 years ago. Like, that's a big time frame. But if I mean it's been fun to see how your career has evolved with you, especially with other people that I've seen and talked to who are I mean, I always hate the term action sports, but like people that do that, it's hard for them sometimes to transition to what is after it because it doesn't last forever.

SPEAKER_05 5:29

And so it's a stick in ball sports, I'd say. Like, even at my age, like there's not a lot of people playing football, soccer, basketball at 38. So you gotta find something afterward,

Salt Lake Ski Upbringing

SPEAKER_05 5:39

even for those people.

SPEAKER_03 5:40

Especially when it becomes like so much of your core identity, like I mean, the people who've been playing football since they were six, then all of a sudden they're like, Well, your professional career's over.

SPEAKER_05 5:48

Like, I guess if you were a star, you probably just retire because you got like millions and hundreds of millions, but nothing.

SPEAKER_03 5:54

But there's still something you have to do, whatever it is.

SPEAKER_05 5:56

Still something to take up your time and to feel busy.

SPEAKER_03 5:59

Yeah. But because I'm excited, like, I mean, just setting the stage uh from like Pittsburgh area, Pennsylvania. I mean, how does one get into skiing there?

SPEAKER_05 6:08

Yeah, take it all the way back. I mean, born and raised in Pittsburgh, grew up skiing a small resort, Wisp, and Seven Springs, which is right outside of Pittsburgh, and right by right outside I mean an hour away. But like my parents were just really into being outside, which in the winter, the only activity is sledding, skiing, whatever that is. And just for some reason, I fell in love with skiing because it was an individual sport. I'd played all the sports in high school, I kind of sucked at some of them, most of them, and also was really competitive and hated being the one that lost us the game, or not being like not being included in the play that lost the game, or winning, but having done nothing. Like I hated like too competitive to be on a team and not play the like lead role of everything. So skiing, action sports in general, I tried them all because I was like, they're individual. And it's just me, I want to be good at this, I want to go faster than you. It was all one-on-one, and just fell in love with it that way, and like no one else was doing it but the mountain's small. So you try park skiing because you're like, I could try something on that jump, but the mountain's tiny, but that jump has sort of an endless amount of tricks you could try. So as parks came about in the like mid to late 90s, early 2000s, it was like my small mountain got new life.

Pittsburgh Beginnings In Park Skiing

SPEAKER_05 7:31

You know, the runs aren't any harder, but the train park makes it hard for me. And I just fell in love with like the challenge, the individuality, the style, the tricks, the fear, the adrenaline, and like continue to do it through high school, but was the only person in my high school that could probably make it down a black diamond, let alone like do a backflip, a cork seven, slide a rail. Like, no one else I went to school with could slide a rail my entire high school. Like I was the loner loser in that category until it's like a school ski trip, and then you're like burning down the hill around everybody and you're cool, but it was like just not a thing. It was my weird thing in Pittsburgh.

SPEAKER_03 8:12

Yeah, I mean it's it's like almost comparable if I were to go to be in high school and someone's like, Oh, I go to California every weekend and go surfing. I'd be like, that's how do you surf?

SPEAKER_05 8:22

Why, why? Yeah, what's weird?

SPEAKER_03 8:23

But then it's like growing up here, it's wild because I mean, I like that was always our weekend. Saturday, grandpa would pull up with his truck, throw the skis in the back, all the cousins would hop in, there'd be Gatorade and chips and candy in the back. We'd go ski, have a uh Pier 49 pizza for lunch at Snowbird, and then we'd come home and like rinse and repeat every single time. And it's and then also like in school, if you're in fifth and sixth grade, Fridays free tickets and stuff, free tickets, and Friday they bust you up. You have like a teacher waiting for you to come back down. And it was fun too, because like we would go to Brighton, and the teacher there, he was like, I mean, he was like a park rat, and so he'd see us and be like, We like I can finally have fun with you.

SPEAKER_05 9:02

Like I got I got a good crew, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 9:04

Because it's like where on like uh Great Western, how you know how how you can like dip off into the right and go into the backcountry, and then there's like kind of that like big lip that's kind of in lip back there, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 9:14

It's like backcountry but relatively safe, especially.

SPEAKER_03 9:18

As long as you know how to get back in, you're fine. But if you don't, then you could be walking a lot. Yeah, and so I remember it was like our last day of that. He's like, All right, guys, follow me. Don't everybody see you, duck the rope. And so we go in, and everyone's like, he's like, All right, I'm not gonna tell you what to do, but if you do want to try a backflip, this is the jump to do it.

SPEAKER_05 9:33

Oh, so sick.

SPEAKER_03 9:34

So everybody lands it. Needless to say, I land on my head and have a concussion the rest of the weekend, like throwing up. It was terrible, but still fun.

SPEAKER_05 9:41

Everybody else landed it, you're the only big big crash. No, I mean, not everybody tried crashes.

SPEAKER_03 9:46

I think I was the only I I was definitely the worst case of everybody that tried it. So, which is fine.

SPEAKER_05 9:50

But so cool that that's like part of the the fifth grade teacher and like the community vibe is yeah for everybody to learn. Everybody go try something out there. It's really cool.

SPEAKER_03 10:00

Totally. And like, especially with everybody I've known through skiing or has moved here that I've met from skiing, like the whole I mean, all the ski the east kids, like that is a lot of their experience. Is they come and then they're like, okay, I'm so excited to get to Park City because I've seen all the clips, I've followed everybody there. I've been stuck in. I mean, whether I'm in New Hampshire or Vermont, like whatever the place is, it's a lot of that experience because you don't have the same ski resorts. It's not like you have the vert or the amount of people around doing the same thing.

SPEAKER_05 10:27

Like we had such a small crew of friends that skied park or skied in the way I wanted to ski. It was like five at most, and you move out here and you're surrounded by you meet a new friend every time you go out. Like every time you ride a resort out here and ski the park, if you're by yourself, you're making a friend. Like that wasn't the way I grew up, and I fell in love with that as soon as I got out of here. It was just so like-minded, every single person you meet, and it was just so cool.

SPEAKER_03 10:53

Yeah, I mean, I can only imagine what it's like to be that teenager where I mean, not only just like teenagers in general of how wild that is, but like to have something you're so passionate about, but like it's hard for you to build a community or make friends around. And so it's probably like a lot of the headphones in of just full Tom's going to the park.

SPEAKER_05 11:10

Yeah, I'm going to the park, I'm skiing. If my one friend isn't out there that day or got hurt or has school or something, it's like I'm skiing by myself, like, or maybe with a snowboarder, like never with other skiers the way I wanted to ski for the most part.

SPEAKER_03 11:24

Yeah. So you come out for school. Yeah. Um, remind me, was it the U or Westminster?

SPEAKER_05 11:29

I went to the U.

SPEAKER_03 11:30

Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 11:31

And eventually graduated. It did take 12 years. So anybody that's taking their time, no stress, it uh took me 12, but I did get the degree.

SPEAKER_03 11:40

What's the quote from Tommy Boy? It's like, it took you eight years to graduate. It takes a lot of people. What are you a doctor? Yeah, that one.

SPEAKER_05 11:45

Yeah, or Van Wilder or whatever it is. Yeah, like, and he's not a lawyer or something. No, I just got an undergrad uh in business, so just took 12 years.

SPEAKER_03 11:55

So you get to Utah, you're at the U, talk to me about how, like, because four by nine had existed before you got there, but talk to me about connecting with them and like how that had changed everything that they were doing. You found your community and kind of setting that foundation for what then I mean, catapulted you forward.

SPEAKER_05 12:13

Uh yeah, I mean, that first year was so cool. And I look back on like the first and second year of college, living in Utah with the absolute fondest memories of maybe the like most important, impactful time of my life, just being surrounded by that crew of guys that I met out here, like so like-minded, all wanting to ski, wanting to make videos at the forefront of creating films and edits about skiing. Like, we all found each other at the University of Utah within like a week. You know, it was like you're wearing a beanie that's a ski brand, and you're walking around campus, and you just talk to that person. So within, I mean, we weren't in the same dorm or

Moving To Utah And Finding 4By9

SPEAKER_05 12:56

you know, we were all spread out a little bit, but within a week or two, best friends coming together, trying to go like step onto a handrail with our skis on in September with no snow around, just like steal a trash can and step onto a rail and get ticketed by campus security. Like we became such a close crew, and it was just so fun to go from living in the east, having school and high school like five days a week to setting my classes up Tuesday, Thursday, every other day. You're skiing in the winter, and when it's not ski season, we were finding a trampoline park or finding a height to do or something all together, and it was like this moment of just finally being surrounded by so many peers with the same mindset, the same motivation to go out there, and just people that were as good, if not better, skiers than me to go from being like the only skier with no one around to really push me to like having so many friends, as good if not better, to like all learn together. And it was like the best years of my life, like just so fun, learning so quick, and just nothing mattered, no real life. I mean, it was awesome.

SPEAKER_03 14:10

It it's it's it's like back. Well, and it's like such an iconic time because like that's like peak new schoolers era. Yeah, everyone's like kind of like it was where all of these kind of like clicks started to happen a lot more geographically. There's a more than a handful in Utah, and people are like, Oh, like we can all like we have our film guy who's like not the best skier, but he wants to be there, so and he likes to film and edit, so we'll ever do that. I mean, like you're Evan Heath, yeah, and who loves that, loves skiing, loves being a part of it, and then just be able to like film, get content, edit, put it on new schoolers, rinse and repeat, kind of before the social media era.

SPEAKER_05 14:45

Yeah, I mean, it was before social media. There was you know videos going up online. I don't even know what year YouTube started, maybe 04. Yeah, I think 3004, but like I just felt like ski content at the time was like very long form, and like before social, nothing was less than a minute or two, and all we were about was like, that's dope. We made like a one-minute edit, let's put it on the internet and see what people think. And every crew at that time in that 2005-2006 era, it just was like what you did because you wanted feedback from the online community, from new schoolers, you wanted to share it with your online friends, and that's like where social grew from and where everybody putting content along kind of came from, and being there at the beginning was so crazy to see like you do one video and you're like, Oh, cool, like I think like a thousand people watched it, and then another one on YouTube gets 300,000 views, and at the time you're like, What just happened? Like, I don't even think there's that many people in the US, and it's like we're just dumb.

SPEAKER_03 15:52

There's more than that, but like it becomes very unfathomable very quick. Of like, you're you're telling me that three 300,000 people were like sat down, watched this, and like, cool.

SPEAKER_05 16:02

And us like flipping our hats, like acting like gangsters, wearing tall tees and skiing to obnoxious rap music. It's like, well, you watch that? Wow, thanks for that. I'm I'm sad,

Newschoolers Era And Early YouTube

SPEAKER_05 16:15

I'm glad, sad. I don't know how to feel.

SPEAKER_03 16:17

Yeah, it's all it's all different stuff. And I mean, especially when, like, again, going to like YouTube was kind of there, but not in the same way. And it was either like these little clips on new schoolers or it's like a matchstick movie that like you're at the East High Auditorium with a thousand other people.

SPEAKER_05 16:39

Hard copy, and we were like internet only.

SPEAKER_03 16:42

Yeah. And there was one time, because it was let's see, because I graduated high school 2009, and so one of my friends that I rollerblade a lot was Alex Bass.

SPEAKER_04 16:49

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 16:50

And there was one time he's like, Hey, like, because I think we're done, like we were skating, and he's like, Which is so weird because he's a rollerblader, yeah, but a snowboarder.

SPEAKER_04 16:57

Why wasn't he a skier?

SPEAKER_03 16:59

I've never under like I understand skateboarding and like how fun it is, like the uniqueness of it compared to a lot of things, but I've never understood like if I'm a skier and I want to have something as like similar as possible, that makes sense to me. Yeah, I'm not gonna say like you if you ski have to ski rollerblade because it's not gonna make sense, and like why would you do something different? But yeah, it was just always one of those things that never make so much sense.

SPEAKER_05 17:20

I don't know why more people don't do it.

SPEAKER_03 17:22

Just it's fun to see Henrik like embrace it a lot, really into it. Like, because like it's fun to see him like go to Woodward and just like mean do ski things on rollerblades and have so much fun and it's almost a foam pit and stuff, and like everyone did it.

SPEAKER_05 17:34

I feel like at least in our age range, young. Like, I didn't go to the skate park. Well, went to the skate park a little bit on rollerblades, but it was more like I had an X factor rail in the backyard and would just do ski tricks. Like, I would literally just do two on, pretzel two out on rollerblades, but it was like summer training, yeah. But it was still like I rollerbladed a lot in the summer, but I never really I wasn't doing too many soul grinds, it was all like regular slides, switch ups, like thinking it was so sick because it was like the only way to feel like you were skiing in the summer.

SPEAKER_03 18:08

Yeah, because I think it was I went over to the like the four by nine house once and like and it was fun because like I met on university show big one, yeah. Just like right over by Greek Row, and I remember because like that's where I met. I guess I knew uh like John Kutcher before because he park city kid, met him through Kai, and then like Steve. I think I met him through Bass. And like Steve was just someone I'd always see Weibel, maybe Ryan Weibel came from Park City. Like, because like all those Park City kids were people I knew because like, yeah, because Ryan and his brother Nate, because I'd met Nate and then met Ryan through Nate, and so it's just like all of this, like I mean, for lack of better term, like small lake city, where it's like, oh cool, I know one person, everybody, and then I'd see Steve like every time I went up. So it's like I was one of those, like, oh hey Steve. Hey, how's going? Good to see you, good to see you too. Anyway, moving on, have a good one.

SPEAKER_05 18:50

So, like, just the amount how quickly, like Ryan, Waibone, and Kutcher we found and they became a part of the crew. Like, it's just if you do any of the activities, the outdoor activities here with a whole heart, you're gonna run into the exact same people everywhere and meet all, like it's so small. Like, oh, you know, so you know so and so, like, just the outdoor industry activities here. I'm always like, How do we know each other? Oh, we do.

SPEAKER_03 19:18

Well, and like the thing that's I think fun that a lot of people miss is, and I like to give like a parallel of golf. Like, because I was golfing with a friend and he was like not very good. He's like, I'm so sorry, I wanted a golf one. Like, whoa, whoa, whoa, like first off, chill out. I will it's harder for me to find someone I want to spend four and a half hours with than someone who's good at golf. Yeah, and so in the same way, like obviously, if you're skiing and filming and like pushing each other, you want people that are good, but at the same time, like you still want to be around people you want to hang out with.

SPEAKER_05 19:42

And like fun, yeah, it's important to like golf's a great example. It's like I don't care how good you are, just be fun and like don't break your club and get all pissy and stuff. Like, just just chill, have a beer, it's gonna be great.

SPEAKER_03 19:57

So, and like I think it's interesting because like the Park City time of like, let's call it like that 2008 to 2012-ish, where you're very different. Like, and it's very obvious from like you look at like I mean, like the Candides before that, the JPR Clairs before that, it's very almost like rinse and repeat, everyone kind of wears the same stuff, does a lot of the same tricks, but then all of a sudden this like kind of new wave comes in of I mean, like rap music and tall tees and baggy pants and like afterbang and just things that didn't exist. Yeah, and so I mean, for you being one of the people that really led that revolution, I mean, where did that come from? Or was it just uh you?

SPEAKER_05 20:35

I think it was just, you know, our crew listened to a lot of that type of music and were inspired by other action sports and just like just other artists and stuff that you looked up to, but mainly it was just like it could have gone anyway, it was just to stand out or to be different. And I think it still happens cyclically, like every five, ten years, styles change just because someone young wants to stand out, wants to look different, whatever the size pants might be, whatever the colorway might be. It was just like no one really looked like that, and no one was doing it that aggressively. So you like put your mark on it just to do it. Like it's not like that was the only look I could have gone for. I would have worn anything. All I wanted to do was look cool and look different. And it just so happened that we fell into that sort of you know, rap, music, hip-hop inspired, like tall tees, big headphones, everything about that, just like became our style, and then you just lean into it more when you get like, oh, that's cool, and

Park City Style Revolution

SPEAKER_05 21:38

somebody copies you or you're inspiring someone, like you just lean in more and more and more and take it like as absurd as you can until you're like, Okay, okay, we gotta bring this back to earth a little bit. And I've ebbed and flown over the years, but no tall tees anymore. Those those don't make an appearance. I think you you get you're older than thirty, you just you can't. I don't know, Henry.

SPEAKER_03 22:00

Still does it, so I bet you have one in the closet somewhere.

SPEAKER_05 22:06

Yeah, there's probably one in I don't know. I don't know if they're true to this. The nostalgic tall tea just said.

SPEAKER_03 22:17

Understandable. And like and like that era in Park City was so wild. Like, because I remember going of um the oh my gosh, I can't why can't I think of the line where it used to be? And now it's just a room. King's King's Crown, thank you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 22:28

King's Crown run where a beautiful groomer now, though. Right. Beautiful views. No park.

SPEAKER_03 22:33

But it was like wild to see then. Because like being a kid, I would see the jumps be like, those are ridiculous. Because it would be like these hundred foot tables with quarter pipe lips. And but then even like looking back now at edits, I'm like, oh, they were as big as I remember. Yeah. And like thankfully, now it's like, I mean, like tabletops and things are made safer so you don't like it.

SPEAKER_05 22:50

Yeah, they were a little looser 20 years ago. Like in the builds, they're not as soft impact, they're not as built as safe, and they were just awesome. Yeah. I love that. That run was amazing. And see it from all around town.

SPEAKER_03 23:04

Yeah. Like, and it would be there in like June or July. You'd like go up to Park City to go on Main Street or like Park Cilly, be like, oh, cool, they're still there because there's so much snow in there, the half pipe and everything. And so you have this, I mean, this like this new schoolers era, like you finding four by nine, you like becoming this like such novel thing that no one had seen before. But then there was kind of this transition into more like competition park skiing.

SPEAKER_00 23:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:30

And like, how like what made you gravitate towards that compared to just let's call it like the creativity of just filming style, doing the tricks you want to, to more structure and like that?

SPEAKER_05 23:42

It is a good question. It kind of like just always throughout skiing, like we started the videos, and I got noticed and accolades from the videos on the internet and recognized for that. And it took a while for me to get into any of the bigger competitions, despite I'd always wanted to compete. I've always been highly competitive and always was learning tricks with the thought of like, I want to win Dutour, I want to win the Olympics or X games, I want to win everything like that is possible. And it just like took a while for me, I think, to like build up the accolades to get there. But for me, that was always on there. Even with the filming we were doing, it was like, how can I do the best trick? How can I have the final shot of the edit? We call the closing shot, you know, to like I was always trying to be the best of our crew, of whoever I met, and the natural next step was just competition skiing, mainly because I didn't want to win money or necessarily anything like that. It was just like I want to go to the best parks in the world, and these contest courses are always the best parks in the world, maybe less so now with how much terrain parks have gone everywhere, and every resort has an amazing setup. This was like you go to do tour, and it's like this is the best jumps you'll find all year. So I just mainly wanted to go to these events and compete and prove how good I could be and just so competitive as a kid. And it just transitioned. And slowly, as I did more of these events, I got more noticed, picked up bigger sponsors, and all of a sudden I kind of transitioned from being super, super talty, absurd, talking a certain way, to like, okay, let's tighten it up, let's cut back on uh cussing or be a little bit more family friendly, maybe wear the jacket instead of the hoodie because the brand has a jacket and I want to be

Why Competition Became The Next Step

SPEAKER_05 25:36

a better endorsed athlete. And it was like that series of competitive success that changed me from like you know, the kid that's in college talking the way he wants, and I just learned through the four or five years of high-level competition from the beginning. If you watched an interview of me, it's like I don't know what I'm saying, I sound absurd. But by the end, I I've grown into a professional, right? Like you would through an internship into a real job. Like the first big event I did and the videos we did were my internship to pro skiing. And then by the end, I'm a tenured profess like professor of pro skiing from just learning on the fly as you do these things. It was really cool to see, like, and now I look back, I'm like, oh, that's definitely from 08 because I'm wearing that shirt that says so far so hood with the girl on the front, like, oh my gosh, that's so long ago. I'm so embarrassed. But like it it just it's funny to see the transition over a 20-year career.

SPEAKER_03 26:35

Totally. And like, was there ever a moment where because again, you're this kid from the East, yeah, comes here, makes these friends, you start putting videos on the internet, you can see the numbers that keep growing.

SPEAKER_05 26:46

Which like translated to me thinking I was good, no money, yeah. You know, like I wasn't making any money.

SPEAKER_03 26:51

Well, oh yeah, and that's how it was then.

SPEAKER_05 26:52

Like everybody's like days, maybe you get paid for YouTube views. We weren't getting paid, we were just stacking views and buying, you know, eating at the HC at uh at the U and like trying to survive.

SPEAKER_03 27:05

Totally. And was there ever like a moment, whether it be like a clip you posted or I mean whatever it might be, or like validation in like the new schooler forum, like where you're like, oh, like people watch me and like are I'm like I'm having an impact on skiing more than I ever thought I would.

SPEAKER_05 27:21

I mean, there's two that I can think of very vividly, like the first one that kind of set me up and motivated me more than anything was in 2007. I put out this super unknown video for this level one contest, and it wasn't winning the event and filming with level one, like that was amazing, don't get me wrong. The feedback in the comment section on like that video was the absolute fuel to like my competitive self that like got me to where I was. It was kids telling me like not only how great the skiing was or how stylish it was, but also like you should be in X games, you should do this, you should do that. And I was like, Oh, like this, I can do it. Like, if they think I can be in X games, the only reason I continue to like make it that far in competitive skiing, I mean, I wanted to compete, but like I pushed and pushed because of feeling that like backing from the community, which was so cool.

SPEAKER_03 28:21

Yeah, I mean, because it's one sort of confidence that's good to have within yourself of like, oh, I've always been a competitive person, I've always liked these individual sports because it's me or no one else.

SPEAKER_05 28:30

But finally, somebody's like, yeah, like you get real support is like crazy.

SPEAKER_03 28:35

You have a couple hundred kids on the internet being like, hey man, you should do this. Maybe I should do this.

SPEAKER_05 28:40

Like, and then finally, when I did win some money, I was like, okay, maybe it'll be a career. Because for a while there, I was like, I'm just really going into credit card debt, and I'm barely getting by, and like my parents aren't helping me anymore. What do I do? And then you win 15 grand at one event, and you're like, oh, okay, I can do this.

SPEAKER_03 28:57

There's a quote from our uh scene from Boy Meets World growing up where one of the characters goes to his teacher, Feeney's like, Feeney, I got $5,000. I'm a millionaire. And so it's like, imagine like it's it's fun talking to like friends who have won contests early in their careers and think it's like they're like I'm I've made it, it's done. I've I'm gonna go buy a truck.

SPEAKER_05 29:16

It's like, no, no, that's not what you should do. 15 grand is not that much. But at the time, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 29:22

I mean, like the biggest things, especially at that time, is like, oh, I have a sponsor that's gonna pay for me to go somewhere. Oh, I can get skis

Online Validation, Sponsors, And Poles

SPEAKER_03 29:28

now. I don't have to pay for boots. I don't have like I like you just sent me three kits. Okay, like amazing. So sick. Because then I think it's like this interesting time because like you start competing, but I feel like there was this almost public rejection of like that Tom, where it's like, oh, I'm gonna compete without poles, like, eh, we're gonna dean you for that. Yeah, or we're gonna do this, like, eh, that's not the way we like it. Like, was that could I could see that being either motivating and being like stick it to the man, or demotivating, be like, well, they're like they're not accepting me. Like, I I can't fit into this thing to win. Like, how did you deal with that?

SPEAKER_05 30:03

Yeah, that's a funny story. I did compete at the Aspen Open without polls and got really, really, really badly scored. And I think I picked up polls after that. And I ski without them sometimes, but I think the I conformed. Yeah, I got to the point where I was like, fine, I'll conform. Like, maybe at the end of that season, I was like, fine, I'll I'll wear poles. Like it was just a unique style thing, and now people go back and forth. But I was like, Yeah, I'll pick them up. If that's what you want to see, I'm gonna prove to you that like I'm still gonna win.

SPEAKER_03 30:36

Yeah, I'll play on your roles and I'll still come out on top.

SPEAKER_05 30:39

But I forgot about that. Yeah, now I've skied with them ever since. Yeah, poles are nice.

SPEAKER_03 30:44

Oh, I know.

SPEAKER_05 30:45

I mainly just like them, not for turning, not for skiing tricks, just for like pole planning off a lip or like pushing through lift lines. It's so lame to walk like all duck style through the lift line, stepping on other people. Like, I just want them to push through the lift line and like stand there and look normal.

SPEAKER_03 31:05

Yeah, you're on some cat track and you want to be doing like the cross country scare one.

SPEAKER_05 31:09

I'm not pole planting off there, but like it's pretty style to do a pole plant cork seven candied style.

SPEAKER_03 31:15

Yeah. Well, and I like oh, that's a perfect reference. Yeah, exactly. Um, well, and I like that you have this crew, and I kind of like we were talking about of like, I want to be the best, I want to have the closing shot, I want this. Was there anybody in particular that time that you felt like you were competing with the most or like almost like this ride, like unspoken rivalry?

SPEAKER_05 31:32

Not really. I mean, it was the whole crew. I would say, like, big shout out Steve Stepp, who came from Pennsylvania with me, and like we were very equally matched in terms of talent and skill, but like he was better than me for sure at all levels of jumping when we moved from Pennsylvania to Utah. Like, I was pretty good at rails, we were pretty, pretty likewise, but like he was so good at jumps compared to me, and it took me so long to be out here to learn how to hit jumps correctly, and like he was like the guy that like probably should have made it even further than me, but it was like me just trying to keep up with him, and then he has an injury or two, and I can surpass. But like him, uh Rich, Tim, AJ, all these guys in that four by nine crew were so good, and we were all very equal when we came to Utah. It was just by pure whether it's talent, luck, work ethic, we're all working really hard. I just like fell into like trying once more when somebody would give up or crash hard and get back up, or whatever it was, just like pure luck, hard work, and maybe just a smidge of talent, but like not much. I was never that good. It was just in just over time, absolutely nine to four, nothing else on my mind, all I focused on and just worked out eventually. But like it was having them around that credits to my success. And it's the same thing for any kid learning today. It's like you can't just go train by yourself, you're not motivated, you're not pushed, like surround yourself. And I try to do this with golf too, now that I play a lot. It's like if you play with people that are way better than you, I think it makes me way better. I'm like, oh, I'm a little embarrassed because I like just slically I want out of bounds, but like I'm gonna do better next time. I want to practice, I want to get better. I watch them. It's like so good to be surrounded by people, whether they're smarter, whether they're better in activity, whatever it is, surrounding yourself by those people. And that's what the first year in Utah did for me. Outside of, yeah, the terrain's better out here. It was the people I think that got me to the level I was. Within one year of living out west, I went from a random kid skiing to like known across the internet and the world.

SPEAKER_03 33:49

But like that's such like that's such a good skill to learn because a lot of people think, and quick tangent, like it's wild to see like Woodward and those things exist now. Oh my god. Because it's like, oh, cool, I can go to these perfect jumps, I can go to the tramp, I can go to the foam pit, and I can go like get things dialed in more before I take it to snow. Whereas then it's like, well, I'm just gonna throw it over the jump, and if the if I get wrecked, I get wrecked, and I guess we'll get on the lift and get back up. Yeah. And so jealous of all the kids today. But but and and I like like that's such a good skill to learn because it applies to so many things, not just skiing, of like, I'm gonna go, I'm gonna put in the intentional effort. If I can't do like grab blunt perfectly capped, I'm gonna do quark sevens and like until I can grab perfectly blunt, yeah, I'm not gonna give up. Or oh, they just gave me polls and it's harder for me now. Cool. I'm gonna go back and do it all over again. Or oh, I can't do all seven, like switch up two out. I'm gonna go do it until I can do it every like every run in a row.

SPEAKER_05 34:47

It's gotta be just insane in your head. Like you've gotta just keep trying, and it's so nuts. But like that was my biggest thing, was just reps, like until you get the grab perfect, till the rotation's perfect, like and it's just so maddening. I mean, it is the definition of insanity trying something over and over again, expecting a different result. It's like I'd be like, why? It's the cork's not the right way, or you're trying a rail over and over and you never get it, but like just something about it is like so sweet when it works out.

SPEAKER_03 35:19

Was there ever one of those tricks that just kicked your ass more than anything?

SPEAKER_05 35:23

So I'm trying to think of like a good example of one, but like even just like the first like sevens we would try and trying to do a cork seven before foam pits, trampoline, like all this other access. It was like, was that cork? No, dude, it was just a seven. Or you remember that one? Kids would be like, I swear that was cork. It's like, no, you were just looking between your legs, dude, and it's maddening when you want to try it, but like now it's like try it on the airbag, and it's not that scary. It was just scary to commit to something. And then, like, I did a world record rail slide years ago. Actually, no, I'm gonna touch on that because like that was maddening because every day you try it like 50 to 80 times and you don't get it, and you come back the next day. Like, what am I doing with my life? Like, why?

SPEAKER_03 36:09

Well, because there was a clip that Nigel Houston posted the other day of him, it was like this like flip into a ditch, but like the ditch was gnarly, and it like took him years and like wrecked him. But I mean, hey, how did that come up of being like I want to set the world record, rail slide, and then yeah, and after that, and then want to follow up something else.

SPEAKER_05 36:29

Yeah, no, I mean, for me, rails have always been like the highlight part of skiing. It's what stood out for me coming from the East Coast. We had rails, we didn't have jumps, and I got into jumping

Reps, Trick Progression, And The Rail Record

SPEAKER_05 36:40

and slope style and big air, but like rail skiing and rail specifically were like the attribute of skiing that like drew me in, and I don't know why. It's because it's an endless possibility on the easiest thing to create with the least amount of like something about it is so accessible and enjoyable, and I just like because of my love from that from coming from Pennsylvania, the only world record that you could do on skis in Pennsylvania was rail, and like I had always dreamed of like I didn't even know what it was at the time, maybe it was like 250 feet. I was like, I could do that, like what we should build it, and it took years of like building up sponsor relations and business stuff to be able to like fund it, get Guinness to come out, build the rail, have a resort partner to work with, like everything takes so much facilitation, and like that being said, there's a lot of great rail skiers. If someone built another one, they would break the new world record. It's not it's hard, it's incredibly hard, but like it just takes a lot of money to have like a 500-foot rail and then have Guinness there. Like, it I mean, we had a guy from Guinness and loafers on snow, like, and he had to watch, he had to verify the measurements. Like, there's so much that goes into it, but like, I mean, we set it all up, probably spent like you know, the whole shoot is like a hundred grand. Yeah, and if I don't get to the end of the rail, we're shit out of luck. Like, no pressure, no pressure. If it was supposed to be a show on TV, on ESPN, it was all these things, and it's like, wow, four days in. I've tried like three or four hundred times. Like, am I ever gonna get it? Yeah, and like we went through iterations of different steepness, different pitches, the way we set it up, and eventually I did get it. It was like the most fun, rewarding rail slide, but like the 400 other ones were really frustrated, and I kind of was like getting depressed and really exhausted, but it's just like one of those things where so much effort goes into it and the payoff is like so worth it, but then you're like, wow, we we did a lot.

SPEAKER_03 38:51

Yeah, like I need a beer and I need to go home because I'm done with it.

SPEAKER_05 38:54

It was Easter Sunday of that year, and I was like, Why? What am I doing? Like in the town, my parents live down the road. I'm like not with my family on Easter Sunday, just sliding this rail side. It was so hard to get somebody to come like work the thing because it's like what resort was it at? Seven spots.

SPEAKER_03 39:16

So, I mean, obviously, you start like competing, and like I mean, it's competitive, obviously, and there's so many people there, but then you start to like for lack of a better term, like dominate. Yeah, and I feel like that's kind of when it went from this I mean, kitten Talties that's like at Park City and new schoolers to like, I mean, the corporate sponsors will be like, Yeah, well, sure, we'll go build a 500-foot rail here and do this. And I feel like that was almost like where like a lot of the fun started to happen, and like filming with level nine, sorry, level one and like all of those parts. But like what were some of those highlights or things that you think about most fondly of those times, whether that be, I mean, competing and like winning your first X Games gold, or like the part that you put together, you're like, this is a professional ass part. Yeah, and I'm very proud of how this came together.

SPEAKER_05 39:58

I mean, it's really all of that like era, like it blends together because there was it's so action-packed, and like being that age range, whatever it was, maybe I'm 21 or 22 through 27. It's like the best. You're so energized, motivated, like still not that many real-world commitments, like, not really like a mortgage, or like you're not worrying about all the real life stuff as much, and just was so focused on it. I just remember like first X Games Gold was obviously like a huge moment. Winning X Games at Aspen in 2012 at night was like, I mean, all the competitive stuff is like you win an event, it's a highlight, but like they all kind of blend together, which is funny enough, looking back from like this view 10 plus years later, it's like it is more those film segments. Unfortunately, I was still filming during the time, but like I can still watch The Wallish Project, which is a video we made in 2013, me and Kyle Decker, and it was solo project, same kind of era as Nija Houston's first solo project, which was like an inspiration because it was like instead of a ski movie, instead of a edit, we were like one athlete, one filmer, this is gonna be everything. I'm gonna show everybody how good I was, or was at the time, I guess. And now it's like I look back on that, that's like the same era I won World Championships gold. And it's like, yeah, that event mattered, and it was so cool and so felt so important to me at the time. But the videos just live on, like the moments, it's just so much more work. You don't remember all the days of learning, the double corks that go into the slope run. You remember standing on the podium or losing and being bummed, but the film segment, like every shot has a story, and you remember the whole night or the whole day in the backcountry that leads up to that shot. And for some reason, I'll watch that video and I'm still like, man, what a fun year! And then I'm like, oh yeah,

X Games Wins And Film Segments

SPEAKER_05 42:03

I won world champs that year, but like, where is that world championship gold medal? I don't even know. Like, is it in my office? Like, where is it? Like somewhere. It it matters, but like I'm so happy and so fortunate that I had the film stuff going on throughout my competitive career because the reason I made it big, got the corporate sponsors is definitely from the competitions. But being entrenched in the video side is what led to that post-competitive success. And me, I mean, I must have stopped competing in 2015 or 16, and now it's 10 years later, and I feel like my career is still as good as it was the day I stopped competing, from the brand relations, all because of like that buildup of video work, sponsor relations, negotiate, like everything with it is just so much more important than just how many times you spun and did you win a medal.

SPEAKER_03 42:56

Yeah, and then I mean, in my I would think it makes for a very busy winter. Because if you're training for okay, cool, so we have World Champions coming up, we have X Games coming up, we have Tutor coming up, okay, like logistics, those are those weekends, after either this practice, warm by the park, but then we also have to go to like British Columbia because we have to go back up to like Revelstoke or Whistler to go get this shot, and have to meet so-and-so to do this. Like, how did you manage a schedule like that?

SPEAKER_05 43:19

I mean, you just literally are on the grind. I mean, when I'm home, it wasn't like let's go have fun. It was like, unless it whatever day it is, when I'm in Utah, if it was a pal day, we were filming backcountry. If it was not, and it was a park day, we would like ski park, film that. I'd probably be training, and then we'd go film a handrail at night. Like it was just not a lot of sleep and a lot of, I guess, coffee and monster energies. It just like But we're young. Like I had all the energy in the world. I could sleep on somebody's couch on a trip for four hours, get up and ski, and do something new the next day. Now I'm like, If I don't get eight hours of perfect sleep, I am wrecked the next day. I'm a lot older. I just like it was just in love with the game and just grinding. And I see like young athletes now living that lifestyle, and I'm like, oh, that's so cool, man. I hope you're enjoying it. Like, you're really doing everything.

SPEAKER_03 44:20

Like, like, do this while you can.

SPEAKER_05 44:22

Do this while you can. I miss it. Oh, it was like skipping Thanksgiving dinner and having my girlfriend at the time, now my wife, like mad at me for not coming to the big friends Thanksgiving, because I wanted to go get away with a rail on campus at the U. That like Thanksgiving's a good night to hit a handrail where you're not going to get in trouble. And it's like, and it took two nights over that holiday weekend. And I'm like, I'm sorry, but like I needed it. But like she stuck it out. Now I'm home a lot more than I used to be.

SPEAKER_03 44:50

What a trooper. And it's fun too, because like when I look at it's ironic because like whenever I open up iTunes on my computer, the only movies I have are like some old screen. Yeah, well, it's like the all from college of like all the level one movies. I mean, it's probably exactly like and so it's funny now, like like kind of paralleling what you're talking about, like those are the things that live on forever. I go back and watch, like they're literally on my like cloud account and will be forever.

SPEAKER_05 45:13

When you don't have internet or you're on a train or a plane or whatever, and you're like, oh, what's on there? Oh, okay, let's watch that. Like it's there.

SPEAKER_03 45:21

Yeah. Quick random tangent that came to mind. Um, so like one of like the best edits that I mean, if you put it in like a bracket comp uh competition, usually wins or is in the semis with like the slumdog alienaire.

SPEAKER_05 45:34

Oh, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 45:35

Who came to who first about doing it?

SPEAKER_05 45:38

For uh For you and Simon. Our our second that is the secondary meetup, I guess. Or are we talking the Joss edit or Simon's slumdog alienaire edit? Joss. Joss originally was Simon Came to me. Yes. The original Joss edit from 09. I was kind of really coming up like the hot thing on the internet. Still not tons of competition success. Maybe just at the end of 08 or spring of 09, maybe I did something, but like he approached me. He was like, I need some like flavor to add to this. He know we knew he needed a partner, and I was like, Really?

SPEAKER_02 46:17

I mean, that's gotta be wild to be like, you want me to show you how to do that.

SPEAKER_05 46:22

Sure. Seven-time X Games gold medalists or whatever at the time. He's only like a year older than me, or maybe nine months older than me. We're close to the same age, but at the time I was like, This guy is such a legend, yeah. And it was a huge honor, and we had so much fun like doing all that together. And it's like, I really like that edit still lives on. And again, the people that watch it probably don't even know what the film event was that it's in, or what why we were there, like it the events and stuff, and we didn't win. I don't even think we placed in it was like a film edit competition. We definitely didn't win, but nobody really remembers the winning video, they just remember that one because it was fun.

SPEAKER_03 47:02

Well, and it's funny sometimes you look back, like the one that I always come back to is I think it was either 2012 or 2013, like album of the year or rap album of the year went to Macklemore. Um and you look it back, and it's like when Kendrick Lamar, like out of pimp a butterfly came in. There's like the other three are like timeless ones now.

SPEAKER_04 47:18

Yeah, and so you're like, but yeah, McLamore?

SPEAKER_03 47:21

Okay, okay, like Thrift Shop? Like we were there, like I get it, but like anyway. But funny. So I love like this your like career starts to sunset as far as like you in the competitive realm, but I feel like that's really when you started to lean into filming a lot more, and especially like the birth of like good company.

SPEAKER_00 47:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 47:38

I mean, talk to me about how like your logical or like how you approach this, okay. Like, I'll be in your level one movie, do well, to like, oh, I want to do this um solo project to actually I'm gonna take I'm gonna do the whole thing myself now.

SPEAKER_05 47:53

Yeah, I think for me, like being in the film space and as I transitioned away from competitive skiing, I also, you know, having been business minded, having been in these classrooms and understood like ownership of this stuff and seeing where the money and the value to brands go, it was just not like a selfish play, but more like I'm sick of like not being in charge and not like knowing where the footage goes, who's paying who, what sponsors are paying for what. And it was just like I want to be in charge of what trips we go on and where we go. In the years prior, I was like told, okay, there's a Japan trip coming up if you want to go. And I'm like, I don't want to like. I mean, you always want to go to Japan, whatever it is. I don't want to go to whatever trip it is, I want to go somewhere else. So 2014-15, I transitioned away from competing and I was like, How do we take ownership of this? Like, how do we as athletes become the film production company so that we can make a better, not a better video, but a great video, and also have a better impact for the brand sponsoring it, where we're sharing the footage easier, the athletes are getting all their footage.

SPEAKER_03 49:10

It was all about ownership and feels like way fewer middlemen and involved in like, yeah, just come talk to me. I know how to film, I know I know where to go, I know what to do. Let's just do this.

SPEAKER_05 49:19

Just all about, yeah, like the athletes kind of driving it and choosing where we went. And I kind of just wanted to like do it with my friends rather than meeting up with um other pro skiers who are all great. It was like, yeah, but like I want to involve like my close friends that maybe

Good Company And Creative Ownership

SPEAKER_05 49:33

aren't gonna be a tenured professional skier, but they're really good and deserve some shine.

SPEAKER_03 49:38

Yeah, there's a difference between doing it with your friends and doing with like the homies.

SPEAKER_05 49:41

So yeah, it was uh it was such a good era, and still to this day has learned so much. Like doing those films, we're we didn't make like a good company film this year, but I produced a movie for North Face. So, like, was in charge of budgeting filmers, edit, the whole team, like doing all the like budget controls, and it's like I learned all those skills working good company, which was just like fun for us to make ski movies, but like now I feel like I could actively go out and like produce a movie for anybody, maybe not anything but action sports, but like find the right people and set it up, and it's like a new role that I've found for myself to keep me in this space, which is like all thanks had taken some initiative 10 years ago.

SPEAKER_03 50:27

Yeah, and I like the way that you put that because I recorded with Julian Carr a while ago now. Oh, nice. But he kind of had that same perspective where I mean he was going on these trees, I mean on these trips, he was skiing these amazing places, having this experience, but he couldn't help but realize like the end is gonna come at some point, yeah, and what are you gonna do then? Because he can't just hang up the skis and then go sit on your couch.

SPEAKER_05 50:48

If you're not gonna be the filmer on the trip, you're not gonna be like there's so many roles. Where's your next role?

SPEAKER_03 50:54

Yeah, and with him it was okay, I'm gonna go start uh company discrete. Yeah, go start start discrete, which then turned into, oh, I'm gonna go start Circ series, oh, I'm gonna go start this like Bronco uh they have like 20 Broncos or something.

SPEAKER_05 51:07

It's insane. But like continuing to find ways.

SPEAKER_03 51:11

Yeah, and I think you're a good one. Like, it's funny to talk to people now, like any of like the quote, the youths, and they're like, oh, I'll be a pro skier because I can make so much money. You're like, uh, I urge you to reconsider that, like from the money perspective, like you could do a lot of cool things.

SPEAKER_05 51:24

You might make some money, but like good luck making a ton of money.

SPEAKER_03 51:28

But I think you're a great example of someone who's been able to make it work actively, yeah. Like, especially when uh like around that like 215-2016 time is like when the Olympic started to come into the picture, and slopestyle is there. And I can't remember, were you trying to make the Olympic squad at that time?

SPEAKER_05 51:44

Yeah, I was trying to make the team in 2014, but I had a blown knee at the time that whole winter, so I was like skiing, but I couldn't really land forwards, only backwards. So it's really hard to put together slopestyle runs when you can't land forwards because of like the bone bruising or whatever was wrong with my knee. But yeah, I ended up not making the team, which was totally fine in the long run and hasn't changed my life at all. And our friend Joss Christensen from Park City was that the final member that made that team and went on to win. So it's like all's well that ends well. At the time, it was like my world ended, and then I had to get surgery and not ski for six months, but like it was fine, it was just bad timing to come off world championships win, Wallish project release. Okay, let's buckle down and train for the Olympics, blown knee right away, right before the Olympics. Like, ugh.

SPEAKER_03 52:38

Heartbreaking.

SPEAKER_05 52:40

But again, like it I wouldn't change anything. Totally. I got to go to the Olympics this year, didn't get to compete, but better believe I skied the course, so that's good enough. Totally, and I got paid to be there.

SPEAKER_03 52:50

Even better? Yeah, like if we're going to Italy, sounds great. Sounds good. And like it's fun with like Joss in that moment because he was like more or less not really known. And then now you see what he's done now, and like with slush, and just it's like it's fun to see those moments where like the baton gets passed. Yeah, and it's fun to see like, I mean, especially like there's always gonna be some kid in Park City that ends up being that guy.

SPEAKER_05 53:11

The next thing. I don't know, something about the Olympic team this year, like 18 or what was it, maybe 20 or 25% came from Utah, and like so many from just up there. It's insane.

SPEAKER_03 53:23

Insane. And so I like that because I want to transition to that, because like that's another thing that you've been able to do to keep very involved in skiing, is like announcing. And so it's like funny now to like um like I think I was watching Olympics with my girlfriend, and it was I was watching Slope Sound. She's like, Well, how like who announces this? And I was like, actually, it's funny you should mention like he is that guy, like he should be, like he's like one of like because you

Olympic Push, Injury, And Perspective

SPEAKER_03 53:47

I I it's like so cringe to me when you watch something like that.

SPEAKER_05 53:49

They're like, you see them do a spin thing, and then they do the rail thing, and you're like somebody that really doesn't know it, but maybe they have a good voice or something. Where I'm like, I kind of hate my voice, but I feel like I know the sport really well. Yeah, I just wish I was a little bit calmer and deeper and a little bit more golf voice.

SPEAKER_01 54:06

Yeah, and here we go. He's gonna go with the switched up 12. And oh my goodness, yeah, got that mute crap perfect.

SPEAKER_05 54:12

Oh, but it's so fun. I mean, I don't know how that one I found it. I guess I just like watching the announcers, I was like, this is great, but like sometimes somebody would get a trick wrong, and I'm like, I think I could do that. And I just like don't mind talking, have always been a storyteller, um, an extroverted guy that wants to talk or wants to say whatever, and then somehow I got the opportunity to like try and yeah, what was the first time you was at an X Game? I mean, I like maybe announce like some minor events, like just for fun, like a local rail jam, but like I pretty much got sent in first time, X Games, which is a huge event to just be like, here's your first time, call this. But I was with a friend who was really good who was the guy passing the baton to me, Luke Van Valen, and he just killed it and let me you know do my thing, but like it took a time or two. The first time was too much talk, really annoying, and I look back on it, and it's the same as like the skiing. You're like, I can't believe I sounded like that, and now I'm like, oh, it's easy, but anything with practice like just gets better, and it's a way for me to go to all these events, see all the skiers, ski all the courses, and continue to like hopefully make our sport or help our sport be

Learning To Announce Freeskiing

SPEAKER_05 55:30

seen in a good light for the Olympics. It's showing a Midwest mom like describing the tricks so she understands and she thinks it's cool and respectable and very fun, so that that kid that lives at Highland Hills can go try park skiing all day, every day. Like, yeah, my whole point of it is to like you know continue to do it till the next person does it better than me or wants to do it. I really, it's not like I need it. I just I want our sport to sound cool, right, well explained, and for the degrees of rotation to be accurate for the athletes.

SPEAKER_03 56:04

It's not like they span around a lot.

SPEAKER_05 56:06

Uh it's a 2340, we gotta get counting here.

SPEAKER_03 56:10

It's it's wild, like skiers, snowboarders, skateboarders, like it's it's wild how good at my like 180 math I am. Yeah. And just keep doing it.

SPEAKER_05 56:18

But and then the 90 math too for like 450 on, or maybe it's an 810 off. Like, it's like, why do I know these numbers?

SPEAKER_03 56:25

And they're like, that was a four-train. I actually know that was a nose butter lip too, but close.

SPEAKER_05 56:29

Close.

SPEAKER_03 56:29

Yeah. Um, but I mean, was it pretty hard to transition from I mean, talking about skiing with friends to being like, okay, I have to talk about this in a way that Janet from Wisconsin can understand, but then also like I would imagine you have to repeat yourself in enough cadence because you realize, like, oh, the average person's sticking around for like 15 minutes or 30 minutes. So it's like whatever I said an hour ago isn't relevant anymore.

SPEAKER_05 56:52

That's kind of like the thing that took the longest was like becoming okay with the repetition of like the corny or the gimmicky one-liner that helps describe the sport or whatever it is. Like the reminder that when I say switch, that means the athlete is going backwards on their skis. And it's like I hate it, or anything like that, because the core audience tuning in obviously is annoyed, and I'm so in tune with like, oh man, my homies are gonna give me such a hard time about this, like, all my friends, but it's like you gotta say it, or whatever the analogy is. And I've learned throughout the years, I've gotten really good at like for X games or for the rail jam on campus of the you. I can be core and funny and not like approachable to a Midwest mom. I'm being like as core and fun as I want to be. Then as we get to the Olympics, you scale it toward NBC approachability, athletes, and respectability, and what the spins are and how they train, and explaining left and right, and all the things. Like, you just like tone it for events, and I've gotten so much better at it over the years. At first, it was like I just called them all the same, and now I'm like, how am I gonna call like I go into each event kind of understanding what the odd target audience is, which is cool.

SPEAKER_03 58:10

I mean, especially when you have someone like uh I'm trying to think of a good example, like Alex Hall. Yeah, who does things it's like, hmm, how do I translate this one for Karen in Minnesota again?

SPEAKER_05 58:19

Like this one might be a little bit tougher, but that's why like for him, I don't necessarily call the trick as much as I say, because I know what he's gonna do, because I've watched practice. I'm like, for those of you at home, watch how differently this rail slide is. Instead of being sideways, he's going forward, like just try to like dumb it down's always the wrong word, but simplify it, like and also like make them understand where to look. And I learned so much from watching other sports nowadays. I've been watching NHL playoffs and NBA playoffs. I'm like, man, they're so good at like pointing me to like where the ball's gonna end up, to who it's gonna get past who are the puck or whatever. And it's like I try to bring that to my broadcast. Like, for this athlete, the key is the rails, or the key is the second to last jump. Watch this takeoff and try to like lead the viewer to come in. And it's been cool to like, I can't watch TV. It's ruined sports for me because if it's a bad announcer, like I'm like, oh my god, like I could what is this guy doing? And it's never like a primetime sport, but like I'll tune into whatever, and I'm like, I gotta turn it off. I can't listen to this guy, he's so bad.

SPEAKER_03 59:28

Totally.

SPEAKER_05 59:28

Like, I'm so critical of color commentators now.

SPEAKER_03 59:32

Yeah, and I mean it, I mean, especially when I mean you go in the first time and they're like, All right, like, good, but like here's what I would tweak and learning. But I mean, when it came around for like the Olympics this year, past year, this year, this year. This year, yeah. Um do you feel like was it like you kind of knew you were gonna be the guy, or did you get a call and you're like, all right, looks like we're going to Italy, or looking at it?

SPEAKER_05 59:52

I did get to call 2022 as well, but we were working remote from Stanford, Connecticut, where NBC's based for the China Olympics because of COVID and difficulties getting over there. So this was the first one I did on site, but I'd say like I kind of thought I had it in the bag, and then like a year before I knew, and I didn't know if we were gonna be in person or at NBC headquarters till like maybe three or four months before, but like getting the call, like you're gonna be on site in Lavinio was like the like best moment for me because I just still have never like worked or competed in Olympics, like I've seen, but like I wanted to like be in the venue, have you feel the energy? And it was so cool being in Italy for I was there like three and a half weeks or something for this event, and it was just like you see the athletes, I see Alex Hall wins a silver medal in slopestyle, and like I come down out of my booth and I can give him a hug while he's crying, seeing his family. Like it was just so the energy is just like infectious of like the attitude compared to any event. Like, that's the beauty of the Olympics, is like you might all think it's lame and it's like not where free skiing or our sport should be, but like seeing the families and the athletes and the emotion and the news and what's covered and how big it is for our sport to be seen across so many demographics, so many countries in so many languages, it's like it's huge.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:22

Totally. And I mean, are you allowed to go like are you doing laps with them like during practice and hanging? Or like, okay, cool. I'd hope so.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:29

I don't think I'm really like there's probably a workers' comp situation if I were to get hurt on the course. Yeah, so I'm more skiing with them and not really like hitting the features or anything, but like, yeah, I'm on course watching, hanging out right in the chair with Alex Hall and Mac Forehand. And then when they got their medals, it's like,

Calling The Olympics From On Site

SPEAKER_05 1:01:49

okay, you guys are going to what bar? Your parents are gonna be there. I'll see you there. Let's yeah, first round. Let's go to a tower of beer or whatever it is. Like, it was so cool.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:58

And I mean, looking at, I mean, it's wild to think of the kid in Seven Springs that was doing laps on his own to being in at the U and like I mean, tall tees to competing to making your own production company to now going to college in sweatpants and slippers, like the first year. Like, who was I? And then I mean, looking at your life now, I mean, like, what does skiing look like to you these days? Are you still getting out a lot? Is it just kind of changed? Like, talk to me about that.

SPEAKER_05 1:02:25

Yeah, I guess nowadays, I mean, it's definitely changed. I would say, like, my relationship with the actual sport surprisingly hasn't changed at all. Like, my personal love of it is identical. I get like antsy, angry when I'm like, it's winter and I'm not skiing because I have something else going on. Like, and then when I go, I'm the insane person that still goes at 9 a.m. and will ski rails at Woodward for like five hours. I'm not training for anything, I'm not filming. I just like there's an addictive part of my soul that's in love with this sport. I would just say, like, my overall like time to ski has changed, where it used to be all about me and like what could I do? And it was like, what can we film? What am I training for? Now it's like me continuing to find ways to accomplish other goals that bring more, you know, value for me to a brand or to a film company or to a film shoot or whatever it is. Like the hustle is like real for it to be a business. And I continue to try to find ways to like not necessarily make money, but like fulfill my end of the bargain as being a sponsored athlete or a film producer or a commentator, and whether that's the Zoom calls that lead up to the Olympics and the other like life gets in the way. So I don't ski as much as I would love to, but like that being said, my job is skiing. So at the end of the day, I ski 80 days a year, and I'm in love with it, but like I do miss that freshman year of college where like we probably skied, I don't know, 150 days of just like Park City in Brighton, PAL and Park, and it was like the best, and now I'm like traveling the world all season long. Just it's incredible, but yeah, I I still am in love with the sport and don't get maybe as many like soul shred days. I gotta schedule those in.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:24

That's I mean, it's growing up in a nutshell. Like

Skiing Now, Producing Films, Staying Sponsored

SPEAKER_03 1:04:27

you don't have the time to do the things you used to, and now that you do, it's like, well, I like like I always joke about the people that move here in like later life, like late 20s, 30s, and like they have to learn how to ski. Oh, and I'm like, I don't know what it's like to oh, yeah, just go down the mountain, or like, oh, just do this. And they're like, this is terrifying. What's my deductible again?

SPEAKER_05 1:04:45

Like, why am I doing this? I'm gonna get hurt.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:47

Exactly. But I guess now in life, I mean, what else is I mean, what other projects are you working on? What else is taking up your time?

SPEAKER_05 1:04:54

Uh, it's really, yeah. I mean, I it's still all ski. The summers are so good, but like all winter is a delicate balance between the project. This year we did a North Face film that'll come out this fall, and I was not only skiing in it, but producing it. So just so much work with all the scheduling, the planning of the different athletes. It's like 12 different athletes we've shot with eight different filmers on four continents, and it's like just the scheduling and budgeting and invoicing and paying and tracking everything was like this huge production. So, like, that is finally all shot. I'll be working with an editor this summer to finish it, and then that one's off to the races. So, like, outside of that, it's really just like continuing to like do all the other little brand stuff. But like, summers are so chill, and I'll hopefully get to go to New Zealand again this summer to film. Um and really just like trying to continue to maintain good relationships with the sponsors. I mean, working on designing better and better skis every year and doing all the stuff I can to be. The best like representative for these brands, so they'll keep sponsoring me.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:04

Keep the dream alive.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:05

I'm trying to keep the dream alive. I'm I feel like I'm impactful. Hopefully, you guys think so too.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:10

No, I mean I couldn't. I don't know if I could make an argument that you don't. Um, because it's not gonna do a 2340 anytime soon, unfortunately. Yeah, no more spin to win. But it's but now you're spinning cameras and helicopters and like the logistical namers.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:26

Let's spin more helicopter blades. That's the best.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:29

Um, anything else you want to make sure we cover that I missed?

SPEAKER_05 1:06:33

No, not really. I feel like we covered it all. I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:36

Yeah, I think so. But sometimes there's someone's like, oh, actually, it's plugged in anyway.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:39

I got no big things to announce or anything. Life's good. Life's great. I'm not injured, made it through a winter, golf season's upon us, handicaps going down, which is good, but like bad for yeah, match play with the boys, but yeah, it's okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:56

Um well, want to wrap up with the two questions I always ask everybody at the end of each episode. Um, number one, if you could have someone on the Small Lake City podcast and hear more about them, their story, and what they're up to, who would you want to hear from?

SPEAKER_05 1:07:07

I would like to hear from someone that works at the dinosaur museum on campus.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:13

Yes.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:14

I don't know why I just thought of that. I was thinking, I was like, maybe I'll think of somebody from the U. And then I was like, you know what? I would actually tune in to just hear more about either the museum and what we actually have in there because I've walked through it and I just don't want to read everything. So just give me a little bit more breakdown. I drive through Dinosaur Invernal every year on the way to Colorado. I'm like, I would listen to someone describe more of the why and how, how long ago that like period was and what we have here and what sort of species.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:49

I love that like the question I never get asked anymore from when I was a kid is like, what's your favorite dinosaur? You know, like yeah, but like we still like if I were to turn on a podcast, like, hey, we're gonna go through all the dinosaurs, but I'm like, turn up, like, yep, we're gonna go, we're driving to Colorado, might as well listen.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:04

Yeah, especially it's like so past that, like, I don't know, I just feel like the news nowadays is depressing. So let's talk dinosaurs and think about like, yeah, what's your favorite dinosaur? It's a good crash. Everybody says T Rex.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:17

Yeah, I know it's the easy one.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:18

I think I'm a Bronosaurus long neck guy.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:21

Yeah. Just think of all the things you could eat for just look at like thought of just like looking at a tree from the top down, being like, all right, you never see that.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:30

Where does a giraffe wear or a Bronosaurus wear a necktie? At the top by its mouth, or down at the base of the long neck?

SPEAKER_03 1:08:37

Well, I'm gonna find the guy to ask, and he better have a good answer for me.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:39

I just it's a it's classic.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:08:41

And then what's a second? Oh, yeah, and then it it's we digress. If people want to, I mean, follow you, um, just check out the movie when it comes out or anything, keep in touch. What's the best place to find information?

SPEAKER_05 1:08:52

Uh find me on all social media platforms at T Wallish. And that's kind of it. Social, don't really have a website. Um I don't know. Send

Dinosaurs, Where To Follow, Closing

SPEAKER_05 1:09:07

me a DM if you want to get in touch, and uh yeah, we'll see you.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:10

Tom, thanks, man. This is it's fun to see how much you've done for skiing, but still have this appetite to keep doing more and just keep chasing it because you you're just so passionate about it.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:19

So just love it. I'm addicted. Something's wrong with me. I don't know, I got a problem.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:24

No, I think you're right with something. There's a lot of people that don't experience that level of passion or any passion of something. So never let it die.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:33

I'll try my best. I'll be doing this for as long as I can, as long as these knees will allow.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:38

Good. We'll be watching.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:41

Cheers. No, that was fun.