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Small Lake City
Small Talk, Big City
Join host Erik Nilsson as he interviews the entrepreneurs, creators, and builders making Salt Lake City the best place it can be. Covering topics such as business, politics, art, food, and more you will get to know the amazing people behind the scenes investing their time and money to improve the place we call home.
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Small Lake City
S1, E57: Beehive Farmacies - Bijan Sakaki
Warning: This episode contains conversations about cannabis and for those 21+
Ever wondered how a personal health journey could ignite a pioneering entrepreneurial spirit? Meet Bajan Sakaki, whose battle with ulcerative colitis led him to discover the transformative power of medical cannabis. As he shares his compelling story, you'll learn how this discovery turned into a mission to make cannabis accessible in Utah, despite the challenges of navigating a quasi-legal landscape. Bajan's experiences as an immigrant in "Small Lake City" emphasize the power of resilience and personal relationships in building a reputable business within tight-knit communities.
Join us as we explore the shifting perceptions of cannabis, from its stigmatized past to its growing acceptance as a treatment for chronic pain and as an alternative to opioid use. The episode dives into the intricacies of Utah's evolving medical cannabis program, highlighting the transition from traditional dispensaries to pharmacies staffed with licensed pharmacists. Discover how Bajan and his team are at the forefront of this change, advocating for rigorous product testing and patient education to create a safer, more informed environment for consumers.
Throughout our conversation, Bajan's commitment to authenticity and ethical business practices shines through. His passion for using cannabis to genuinely improve lives over pure profit is infectious and inspiring. As Beehive Pharmacy celebrates its fourth anniversary, Bajan reflects on lessons learned, future goals, and the potential for exciting collaborations, including a guest appearance by Jim Morse of Skinwalker Ranch fame. This episode is a celebration of community, resilience, and the ever-evolving journey towards healing and self-discovery.
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My company is Beehive Pharmacy. So I was born in New Jersey. My parents immigrated here from the Middle East. Like I was probably the darkest dude in my neighborhood I got diagnosed with ulcerative colitis. It's like Crohn's disease. I mean. The largest qualifying condition right now in the program is chronic pain. Four and a half years in, we're about 90,000 patients right now. Those are also great questions. I think we're working towards those all as an industry. My flower, I make sure, is better than what's on the street and what you can go to Wendover and get. I'm a patient first and then I'm a business owner. This has been a lifelong journey and we're not even done. Your health, relationships, your friends those are not renewable. I think that's what I learned is a superpower here.
Erik Nilsson:What is up everybody and welcome back to another episode of the Small Lake City Podcast. I'm your host, eric Nilsen, and about five years ago medical cannabis was legalized in the state of Utah and now there's been some learning, some changes, some developments since then, but there's been someone who's been in the front lines, both as a patient and as a business owner, that we have on the podcast today. His name is Bajan Sakaki, who grew up in Salt Lake City, utah, after the age of six, with his parents immigrating from the Middle East, growing up in a very white suburban neighborhood, to being diagnosed with an autoimmune disease which caused him a lot of pain and discomfort, where he ultimately found that cannabis was the solution to that pain and discomfort, which motivated him to participate in the cannabis industry both outside of Utah and now inside of Utah, where he founded the business Beehive Pharmacies, a pharmacy both here in Salt Lake as well as Brigham City as well as owns his own farm where he distributes that cannabis through his pharmacies. So we talk a lot about cannabis use in Utah, cannabis trends, his story of becoming an entrepreneur and owning his own business, and a little bit more about mental health health, where we find happiness, and a little bit of our own personal beliefs and all of that. So, uh, definitely a great episode.
Erik Nilsson:I think you're going to enjoy this one, so check out the conversation with me and Bajan, enjoy. Yeah, it's. It's funny, like, and I I'm like kind of like don't get surprised by it anymore about when I sit down with someone who I don't know and then, within like five minutes, I know all these people Exactly. It's like the exact same social circles. Um, small Lake city, that's the thing. Oh, that's the story of my life, like I remember when, at first cause everybody experiences small Lake city in their own regard.
Bijan Sakaki:Yeah, but then when?
Bijan Sakaki:you put out the energy of small lake city, have a podcast about small lake city. All of a sudden it's almost like the energy of the universe is like that. It's like how small is this city? Yeah, yeah, no, it's good. That's what I like I I think that's what I learned is a superpower here instead of a fault, because it holds you accountable if you're a bad actor, you have bad ethics, bad character. It's very quick to know, like, don't fuck with this guy, whereas you're in another city. There's pockets of so many little clicks that you can reinvent yourself. You can burn somebody, change industries, change your outfit, put on a new mask, get some work done and show up and you're somebody completely different. But and no one knows the difference but here it's like, oh no, like, like I said, like our friend Scott Paul I've known him 10 plus years. It's crazy.
Erik Nilsson:And I've known him 10 plus months.
Bijan Sakaki:Yeah, that's fair, even your other, even, uh, our other friend, scott, the other Scott who I worked with, I worked with, that's fair.
Erik Nilsson:Even our other friend Scott, the other Scott who I worked with. I worked with, he's your boy. Yeah, scott Paulson. And it's funny too, because if you were to draw I don't know what the chart's called, but it's like a circle where everybody gets drawn to the other person if they know each other or some sort of correlation of doing that, and there's a couple people I'm like, oh, I know who the people with the most lines to them would be. They tend to be like the. I think if there's five or six people I could bring a name up with someone and if they knew one of those people it would tell me a lot about them.
Bijan Sakaki:In a good way or a bad way, both, both. Yeah, there's some super connectors out here, for sure. Scott Paul's one of them.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah, oh, oh, like, and it's and it's like a good group, because you're people who it's like I mean successful, creative thinkers, um, definitely like, uh, iconoclastic kind of people who are open-minded and but also like successful, I mean good people who have, I mean, are working on making things a better place. And so it's like yeah, I think it's a great example of like a good thing that you could run into someone they know and be like, oh, like you, you, you pass.
Bijan Sakaki:You pass thing that you could run into someone they know and be like oh, like you, you'd pass. You pass the, the bs, the smell test, the sniff test. But with anything, even here, there's more than a sniff test. You know, um, I came here in 96, so I was born in new jersey. My parents immigrated here from the middle east. Shit wasn't going over well over there, so they came, they came over here. I guess it's a bad time now too, and it's never a good time.
Erik Nilsson:It's never a good time Like. No one's ever like oh, we got a vacation in the middle East. It's finally a good time.
Bijan Sakaki:You know, summers in Kabul are just um no. So my parents immigrated from Iran. Uh, we moved to new jersey. We did the east coast thing. I moved here when I was six. So when I moved here in 96 95 I'm 35 now like I was probably the darkest dude in my neighborhood yeah, which is insane. So moving here to a new place, me being the outlier, the minority not being of the common belief system too, totally in the neighborhood.
Erik Nilsson:It was like a double whammy.
Bijan Sakaki:It was immediate black sheep, like something happened, toilet papering, stealing, reindeer getting stacked, which is actually pretty funny. All of those got blamed on us in our neighborhood. And fast forward now my mother still lives in our house in willow creek and it's I. It's changed immensely. Yeah, like it's such a diverse place, there's so many different, uh, sects of people, sects of people, religions, races, and seeing that shift at first I'm like, wow, this is really hard, get me out. And so I moved to San Diego right out of high school. I was like, fuck this, this place is whack. Um, and I moved to san diego to play professional paintball for a little bit so how did you get?
Erik Nilsson:where did the paintball start?
Bijan Sakaki:paintball started at this really dope place called paintball planet. It's no longer there.
Erik Nilsson:I did my. I did my sixth birthday there. I'm just like my sixth grade birthday. There's okay.
Bijan Sakaki:Over on 94th like Sandy Parkway, gang, gang. And it just became this thing where every Friday and Saturday and Sunday I was there all day. My brother's birthday party was the first time I learned about paintball. I wasn't old enough to actually go, that's tough. I wasn't old enough to actually go, that's tough. So then when I got old enough, I started going. My parents again bless them, immigrant mindset, they're like no paintball guns, you'll shoot your eye out. And they finally got me one for my birthday and it was the coolest thing ever because that's every weekend, just 10,000 hours in Damn.
Bijan Sakaki:And at a young age you learn how to communicate with people because you're playing against people who are 40. Yeah, and I mean, obviously it's like a little weird when 40-year-olds and 15-year-olds are in the same room, but you learn. You're like, okay, cool, this is how I communicate, this is how I navigate, this is how I own somebody on the field. And it just grew into this thing where you get on a local team, a regional team, and then you network, you make friends, they. You try out for a team in california. Yeah, tried out for a semi-pro team, got on that. My friends got me on a european team, an australian team. So you know, 18, 19, 20, 21 was just mobbing country to country to country, seeing the world, um, and it was, it was. It was the most fun I've had in life. It was sick.
Erik Nilsson:I mean doing what you love traveling the world. I mean that's. I mean a dream, no matter how you spend it that that kept me sane.
Bijan Sakaki:Getting through, moved to California, through, moved to california, I got diagnosed with ulcerative colitis. It's like crohn's disease. Okay, when I was 12. Obviously, you're 12. Cannabis is not an option. Um, I'm playing paintball for a team in holland at the time and everything I'm reading about is like cannabis helps with autoimmune, helps with stomach aches, and the whole time. I'm like there's like cannabis helps with autoimmune, helps with stomach aches, and the whole time I'm like there's no, there's no way like yeah my brother.
Bijan Sakaki:He smoked weed in high school. My parents weren't stoked, so like I have this, you know dare mindset where?
Bijan Sakaki:I'm like there's no way this is happening. So it's. It was more like survival at that point. Yeah and uh. First time I didn't have symptoms, side effects, pain. I could eat, I can get up and walk. I mean, I was down to 130 pounds. It was crazy and the doctors were like, okay, this is going to go one of two ways. We're either going to put you on this intense infusion regimen, which I'd have to get treatments every eight weeks, or let's just cut everything out. You'll have a bag on you. It's a great look for an 18 year old and I was just like fuck that dude, like let's do this, let's change my diet, let's start using cannabis. I started going down the path of just knowledge. Is power Inflammatory foods, mindset, cannabis, other plant medicines? I did a lot of internal work. That really full circle. That's why I really believe in what we're doing is because if I never got sick, I'd never find this thing, I'd never be able to help so many people Right, and and I always wondered the whole time like why like what?
Bijan Sakaki:what, what? Why do you get sick? Why do you get sick? And that's just the best superpower ever.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah.
Bijan Sakaki:You know he can navigate now. Now I know what all of my patients go through on a regular basis. Like you have to have find access to medicine, you have to find high quality medicine.
Erik Nilsson:So it's more, it's more of an authentic journey for me now yeah, and I'm and it's so interesting to see because I mean again coming from parents who migrated from the middle east to, I mean, willow creek, cottonwood heights, solid city, utah brighton high school and like very conservative territory like I mean.
Bijan Sakaki:No, no parents to Willow Creek, cottonwood Heights, salt Lake City, utah, brighton High.
Erik Nilsson:School Very conservative territory. No parents in any neighborhood in Salt Lake are stoked to find their kids in high school smoking weed For sure. Still a lot of taboo around it and then to go to a place like in Holland and being in Amsterdam and being like where it's the most acceptable thing Normal, you're 13.
Erik Nilsson:Exactly. And then it's like all right, well, I mean there's two ways this can work. It's either going to work and I feel better and everything's really said, or I'm right where I am and I guess we'll try to figure out what the next kind of experiment is going to be. So I like that. I mean, so you grow up here, you take off from paintball, go around the world, have this, I mean, and then what did this experience? I mean in the light of, like, sunsetting your paintball career and kind of thinking about what the next steps could be. I mean, what was that kind of next step in that transition to where you are now?
Bijan Sakaki:I mean it was twofold. My mom also got re-diagnosed with cancer at the time, so she got sick. I got super sick and I mean it's all connected your body response to stress, response to trauma, et cetera so she got super sick. I moved back to Utah, helped take care of her she was going through divorce and whatnot. Um, then I got sick and then that's when I started the infusions and and uh, so from 20 to 25 was really just wow, this is my life right now. Every eight weeks I'm going to LDS hospital getting infusions and it was kind of a mind fuck because you're told you're sick and this is the only solution and it's going to happen for the rest of your life. So breaking that mold mentally was one of the biggest challenges that I had and I'm super grateful for my good friends, family and people you meet along the way that help you break that, that mindset and that stigma.
Bijan Sakaki:Um, so, 21 to 25, you know I'm like I'm working in tech. Um had a great opportunity to also start my own vaporizer company. This is back in like 2012, 2013, and I have my corporate job for this company. That's no longer around. It's called inside salescom and I'd moonlight at night and on the weekends going to music festivals selling these vaporizer pens. And at that point I'm like, do I go the route that my education and my parents and everything else were pushing me to, or do I run with this? And I try to do both and you can't really do both. And I learned after a long time that something hits like run with that. Um.
Bijan Sakaki:So I stuck in that tech world for a little bit. I had operations in california, I had dispensary california, had some stuff in oregon, uh, tried stuff in colorado. Things didn't really work out. So I learned a lot from the cannabis industry in other markets and the whole time keeping a radar on what's the pulse and the palette for medical cannabis here.
Bijan Sakaki:So it took I think it was an eight-year evolution before the legislation was like okay, this is an acceptable medical framework. That was done through a ballot initiative, which means you have a constitutional right as citizens of the U S to put together this bill, get enough signatures, and then that goes before and becomes law. Our state is probably one of the few that meddled with that. A little bit Like the ballot initiative said X and we ended up with Y, yep and um. As a result of that, we have our medical cannabis program, which went live in 2019 or four or five years in, and that has been my sole focus the last six, seven years of my life is just getting healthy and helping other people be healthy through something like this.
Erik Nilsson:No, I mean that's. It's unreal to see how you went from the one needing the help to now being the one who can help, cause I mean there's always going to be a stigma around weed and everybody just wanting to, I mean cannabis, cannabis.
Bijan Sakaki:That's. That's. That's part of the, that's part of what we're trying to do. Is that's a?
Erik Nilsson:great. I mean I love a good rebrand, um. But I mean that's like the stigma around cannabis is. A lot of people just think it's all recreation. There's no medical application, there is no um good side to it, it's all bad or it's a cheech and chong movie yeah, exactly, and.
Erik Nilsson:But in reality there's so many of these stories similar to yours that it helps so much. I mean, you see, and then all the evidence is starting to come out with and and it's. It's kind of ironic because I mean, there's so many documentaries about it, but essentially, like the war on drugs, ended up with us realizing that a lot of the drugs there's a right time and place. They can help a lot of things in a lot of ways.
Bijan Sakaki:And not to mention that, like there's also with the correlation to opioid offsets, so in in in any state that you introduce medical cannabis, there's a direct correlation to opioid related deaths, opioid related crimes, opioid related abuse, um, from a drug perspective and also, I'm sure, from a physical perspective. But it's crazy to see that just by doing this, there's a lot of other leading and lagging indicators as a result of it. But but we're we're working with the state to get that data and make it more presentable, because I think it'd be great to know, like hey, we saved a lot more lives from opioids. I mean, the largest qualifying condition right now in the program is chronic pain. Even though people are buying sleep gummies, sleep's not a qualified condition.
Bijan Sakaki:So soon I think the program will match what people's needs are in that regard. Like sleep, everyone's using it for sleep, right, but it's not a recognized medical condition. So chronic pain you get a lot of people that come in for chronic pain, acute pain, autoimmune conditions, cancer, crohn's colitis, ptsd is also another big one. So this is not a one size fits all model. I mean this one plant can create hundreds of different modalities for people to ingest, to vaporize, to put on topically. So it's dope. I'm stoked that when I got into this, we didn't have labels like this. You what I mean it was it was.
Bijan Sakaki:This is what I have and this is how much it costs I mean, which is someone that?
Erik Nilsson:so, wow, which is the experience of so many people? I mean pre like cannabis revolution. I mean it would go, your brother's friend who would buy like an ounce and you go get an eighth from him, yeah you don't know what it is and like you'd be in the back of a church parking lot smoking behind like a dumpster or something picking stems out exactly and then now, like I saw a tiktok of this guy's, like I used to, I mean, be paranoid about everything and I'm like vaporizing at target and which not good yeah, I know, but
Erik Nilsson:but it's like that's kind of where we're at and like the amount of people with um that have been like, oh cool, like I mean it's. I mean it's an edible, it's not like threatening, it's such an easy thing to do and I just feel silly. And then I get to go watch a movie and have a pizza and have a great night.
Bijan Sakaki:Or if you're in so much pain you can't even move. Yeah, take one of those, and then now you can function daily. It's crazy because some people are using it, for I can't even get out of bed unless I have this thing. So it's good. I'm grateful. I think we're doing good stuff.
Erik Nilsson:No, totally. And so I mean walk me through the process, because I know, I mean, it's only been within the past five years that cannabis has been legal to any extent. But when we think about it now, then of what it took to get a license to become a dispensary, to become a grower, I mean of then, of like what it took to get a license to become a dispensary, to become a grower, I mean, what does that look like compared to now and what were some of the things that have changed along the way or been a lot of the roadblocks?
Bijan Sakaki:yeah, great, great question. So the program went live in 2019. They issued eight licenses for cultivation. Uh, cultivation is just growing of cannabis. You can do it indoor or outdoor or you can do a mix the two. The difference is the two. Indoor, you can control the environment better, so a lot of the two. The difference is the two. Indoor, you can control the environment better. So a lot of the cannabis you're going to see that looks like came from out of space, like alien type weed. That's going to be more indoor, okay, um, outdoor, use the elements of nature sunlight, water, et cetera. You get bigger plants, bigger yields. Most of those are going to be um, extracted for concentrates, for gummies, for vape carts. Then you'll have greenhouse, which is going to be a mix of the two. That's where you ride that line of affordability and quality. So that was cultivation and then retail went live.
Bijan Sakaki:Part of the re-stigmatizing is changing the vernacular from dispensaries to pharmacies. So we're pharmacies because we have to staff a pharmacist on staff at all times, just like a CVS or Walgreens, and we, we have to, we pay them. They're real pharmacists and those are the ones that you see for your first time coming into the store. They make sure you don't have any interactions, make sure that you know what you're doing and you can abide by the rules of the program, which are no flame to flower. That's why I'm using this little taser looking vaporizer device. This will heat up the medicine to a certain point where there's no carcinogens, no actual burning. So the rules here are no flame to flower and then we'll go through and identify any interactions. Obviously, like somebody has diabetes, we're not going to recommend a gummy that could mess with their glycemic index. If somebody has lung issues, we're not going to recommend inhalation. So that's what the pharmacist is there for. Those licenses were issued in 2020.
Bijan Sakaki:Okay, we're coming up on our four-year anniversary, oct 18th. So in four years, we have stores as North as Logan and as far South as St George. We have three in the Salt Lake Valley. Uh, our second stores in Brigham city. So they're in rural, but they're also in urban areas. Program went live. We were not sure how many people would actually go get their medical card. Yeah, four and a half years in, we're about 90 000 patients right now. Wow, so about 130 140 000 people total have gotten their card, some of which haven't renewed, some of which have let them lapse, but currently there's about 89 to 90 000 active people. Wow, um is a lot, but isn't a lot.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah.
Bijan Sakaki:You know 90,000 people. It's about one and a half percent of our population of three and a half million. But how many of those people are actually consuming cannabis? Purchasing cannabis, you know it's? You get a lot of people that we lose to the traditional market, the illicit market or the recreational market. A lot of people from Utah go to Wendover and.
Bijan Sakaki:Mesquite and they don't have to get a cart. So 2019 grows went live, 2020 pharmacies went live, and then processors went live around the same time. Processors mean you can make gummies and package flour and make vape carts. So the evolution of the program has grown. The state has done a good job of building a platform. Like, every single thing that gets sold gets tested by the state, and they have insane testing protocols so that you know what you're getting is clean. We talked about, yeah, how dirty some of the illicit cannabis can be. So all of our license fees and state fees go to fund that part for the state. That's run by the department of ag, and then the medical cards that you get are ran by the department of health. So we work with the health and department of ag, um, and it's I mean, it's a lot, it's, it's a, it's a big system and we're fortunate to be a part of it. I think the only way you can make a difference is, like by playing by the rules.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah, and it's been. I mean even just using my own personal life as an example, I feel I mean three, four years ago I mean, and obviously, um, covid has an aspect of playing it, but like not really a lot of people had them. There's a lot of people who ask questions if somebody did kind of like a lot of ignorance around it. But then I mean fast forward to like this year. I feel like I've had so many people like bring up, like, oh, I have my card, I have my card, I have my card. I was like, oh, interesting, like I never thought that that many people would be opting to do it, know more about the process so they can do it, and just like further, to get adopted, because I mean, how many states have there been that didn't go from I mean medical to recreational in some way shape or form?
Bijan Sakaki:every state typically goes that route. Yeah, uh, the sentiment here is we want to maintain medical like they want to steer away from anything recreational. So every state eventually gets that way. The benefits of that you have you have more people in the, in the program, because you don't have to get a card, but then you're able to tax it and then you're able to use that money for roads and schools and everything else. So, uh, I truly believe that this program will remain medical for many years.
Bijan Sakaki:Like the difference between our medical program and a recreational program is you're not allowed to smoke. There's no, no pre-rolls. There's no chocolates. There's no crazy packaging Like this is my packaging. There's no like cartoon characters on this.
Bijan Sakaki:Um, so, while everyone thinks like rec, rec, rec is coming also, look at how alcohol is handled. Do you want it to be handled like that? And oftentimes the answer is no. You know when you, when you, when you hand that over to the state, uh, you know you lose. You know you look at you, look at going to a brewery versus going to a state liquor store, and you know you have employees there that really don't give a fuck. They're there for their job versus people that are passionate about brewing, beer, et cetera. So I don't think the sentiment of moving toward recreational, honestly, is there. Um, we talked with a lot of lawmakers and regulators and, look, we just went this program five years. Most programs typically will tip and go wreck within that timeframe, but I think we've done a good job of demonstrating that this can survive within our, our framework, our, our state's very unique. There's a fine line of separation.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah, and with I mean so, now that you've been involved in the industry for like five years now five plus years, what? And again realizing that it's probably gonna be a lot of time as a medical environment than a recreational environment, what changes do you think are should be happening? Uh, to make it it as mean, either as efficient for the consumer or just improve the process in general.
Bijan Sakaki:I. Those are also great questions. I think we're working towards those all as an industry. One is making sure people have access to cards, I think so. This is, this is a Venti. Uh, same guys that make the volcano. These are the. These are. This is everyone thinks that people that consume cannabis can't build things. So these, this is German engineering.
Erik Nilsson:I know, and this is the first hand, this is the first no, no, no.
Bijan Sakaki:It's all good. This is the first handheld device that's actually worked. Certain things like looking at qualifying conditions, for example. We want to talk about getting people in the program. At the very beginning it was like $200 for some doctors to get a card. A lot of people can't afford $200 just to get in the program, to spend a hundred dollars on their medicine. So industry has made changes where obviously pricing has come down. We do a lot of things called car drives now as retailers, where we will work with a doctor. They'll come to our spot spot set up in our parking lot and people can come get their card and then after that they can come shop oh cool rather than having that bottleneck be at specifically one clinic.
Bijan Sakaki:So we're working with qmps, which are qualified medical providers. That's who you go to to get your card Working on them, to have more access and cheaper prices to get people in the program. Us as operators, we're looking at creating more products that people would otherwise leave the program to go get Like ratios. A lot of people want THC and CBD and CBG or CBN. Those things help with different things. So if we don't have them in our program, they're going to go to Wendover, they're going to go to the illicit market. So as operators, we can create products that they would want to produce or they'd want to consume. Yeah, and then as an industry we can look at how do we educate customers Like why would you want to be a part of the program? You can go buy a vape cart for $20 on the street. You don't know what's in that vape cart. That could be the dirtiest vape cart that you ever put.
Erik Nilsson:Yep Literally inhaling poison.
Bijan Sakaki:Yes. So part of our job is education, and the reason why you're paying a little bit more for items in the program versus your dealer or a street plug is we have to pay taxes, we have license fees and everything has to get tested. So everything's moving in the right direction. I think the more we educate people, the more people will recognize like okay, I do consume cannabis to help me with my ailments, let me get a card. I mentioned earlier that the number one condition for people getting their card is chronic pain. Right, so you were in sports, your back hurts, you have chronic pain.
Bijan Sakaki:But a lot of times we're noticing people are buying things for sleep, like those are sleep gummies and I know, you know industry and the Utah medical association and regulators are looking at what other things can they do to make sure they call it a leaky bucket. We don't want to lose patients out of the program, so they're. They're making tweaks here and there, um little rule changes. I think that will keep people in the program. But all in all we're trying to raise the bar, not only quality but access. So my flower, I make sure is better than what's on the street and what you can go to Wendover and get. If I don't do that, then I'm falling short as an operator. So I think everyone is really trying to put their best foot forward and say look, if you trust us, come in, take a chance with our product and we'll find the right product for you. You get to actually talk to somebody. So I think it's moving in the right direction.
Erik Nilsson:I mean, which is good to know, because sometimes I feel like there's like a sentiment, just about government in general, that if it's ever up to them to make a decision, it's probably going to take way too long.
Bijan Sakaki:Yeah, there's not a sense of urgency, but that's why I'm glad. Originally, when the program went live, there were going to be seven state-owned they call them central fill and I'm really glad that now private industry can take over that because, like I said, you've been to a liquor store before you see how they operate. They're not. They have a great budget they can build out, but they're not the most inviting environment, yeah you know you're not going to be able to ask a lot of questions there.
Bijan Sakaki:Totally it's more transactional, that is, more a recreational transaction, totally, whereas with with any store in the program, you have to talk to a pharmacist your first time. After that you're able to make purchases. So it's it's.
Erik Nilsson:It's a it's same same, but different totally, which I mean that's good to know and and it's I always appreciate like the testing part of things, because I mean that's that's the biggest, I mean plus side of having everything be medical and go through the state is there are always some requirements or regulation that's going to contextualize what's actually happening. And so I think and that was one thing I mean when I lived in Seattle for four years it was so helpful to be like, oh, what am I getting? Oh, how is? And again, because like, like as a medicine. You mean you'd be like, oh, cool, a high THC, low CBD or no CBD. I see like and be like, oh, this is what helps me for this, this is what does but the THC is not really the thing.
Bijan Sakaki:a lot of consumers are misconstrued. They want the highest THC. What it actually is is these things called terpenes. So those are the oils and the plants and I thought I thought doterra and young living and all these essential oil companies were all snake oil until we started looking at cannabis and saying, okay, these are the similar oils like this terpene, limonene, limonene is found in a lot of sativa strains and that same terpene is found in a lot of citrus fruits, that blend, that doTERRA or these oil companies. It'll be like energized and it's like grapefruit, orange, lemon and the main terpene in there is limonene. And then I was like, okay, this isn't complete bullshit.
Bijan Sakaki:At that point and you know I've been doing this for over 15 years and in California we didn't necessarily educate the customer on terpenes. It was look, smell, potency, what's the effect? Now that we can look and say terpenes. I know that if you are struggling with paranoia when you try cannabis, we can avoid certain terpenes. If you are struggling with pain and you want relief, certain terpenes will provide that relief. Mersene is a big one. Beta-caryophyllene is another big one.
Bijan Sakaki:Those happen to be found in a lot of indica strains. So indica sativa, it's like old world of indica strains. So indica sativa, it's like old world. People don't like saying indica sativa because it really just classifies the type of plant. It's not really the effect. So with terpenes we can now say okay, how do you want to feel? What are you struggling with? And that's why I challenge a lot of people when they say you know, I tried cannabis back in the day. It wasn't for me. And that's why I challenge a lot of people when they say you know, I tried cannabis back in the day, it wasn't for me. I went paranoid. I started pacing back and forth and and there's a strain that does that for me. It's called green crack, and they call it green crack for a reason.
Bijan Sakaki:That's why I don't use it, and and so I think, if, if people now know, okay, this is how I'd like to feel, if we do our job well, we can, we can Sherpa you to to the right option.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah, it's so fun to see how, I mean, much of the science has pushed everything and see, like, what actual outcomes happen, what correlates more, get more particular and granular about what we know about it. But I'm curious, when you were in California, by your experience there and I mean going from someone who had little to no experience in cannabis and then finding yourself there I mean, what did you learn quickly? What did you learn quickly? What was some of your surprises in your learning process before you came back? So California.
Bijan Sakaki:California had this system called prop two, 15. That was the medical program and that changed in 2016 when it went to Prop 64. So Prop 64 went. Rec 215 was medical Okay, and I cut my teeth in the medical days and it was again during a time where it was still federally legal.
Bijan Sakaki:It was quasi-legal Gray area. You know you're a caretaker quasi-legal gray area. You know you're a caretaker. You have patients that have a right to grow plants that you're growing on their behalf. Then you have a store that's a collective, that's a non-profit, that then takes those plants and sells to those patients, and so it's this quasi supply chain that's regulated. That when 64 hit, that's when taxes and regulations came in A lot of the industry went upside down, and so part of my journey is like, okay, what didn't work in that market and it wasn't something that this person did or that person did, it was what everybody did. Everybody overproducedced. So if you have too much product and not enough people to consume it, there's an imbalance in supply and demand. If you issue too many licenses and there's not enough people to support that, those people will go out of business. So, learning a lot about frameworks and regulations that worked and didn't work. So I don't take it as an L, I take it as a learning lesson.
Bijan Sakaki:Different L, and I am always the one here, the squeaky wheel. That's like yo, this didn't work in California and I think people they kind of shit on me for that because I'm like the wet towel in the room Because they may have overbuilt and they might be experiencing some of those issues. But I would not be doing, I'd be doing a disservice if I didn't share, like, my experiences and it's like hey, dude, the market is the market and our market's not any different. This is economics, so we're not anything special relative to another market that had similar issues. So I learned a lot there. I also learned a lot about diversification. So a lot of people would try to be they call them MSOs, multi-state operators. So when markets opened up, people would go ham. They would just be like cool, license here, license here, license here, license here. You can't be in five places at once and operate effectively.
Bijan Sakaki:You know, it's like like that's why there's certain like when you are going to franchise, you have to have certain thresholds in place and requirements before you can even truly franchise. And like now I get it because if you were just to go not that this is a franchise, but if you're going to go and ramp up a business and try and scale it in a bunch of different states, you got to know what the fuck you're doing. Yeah, a lot of these businesses don't, and so this was early on, like like dot com, you get a license, somebody would overpay you for it. So a lot of stupid money went out. I had a lot of friends that have retired from from stupid money coming in the system and buying their companies.
Bijan Sakaki:And the other thing I learned was like there's cycles to everything. You know, like we're. We're in the middle of a cycle right now. What's going to happen when people spend goes down, costs of weed going down I mean, cannabis costs a lot of money for us to grow. We have license fees, we have taxes, we have, you know, everything else, and and so I learned a lot about okay, how can you do things effectively? So my team, we decided to be a single state operator, sell everything in California, divest in other places and focus solely on this, because if I'm doing this and another state and another state, I'm only operating at 60% at each of them.
Bijan Sakaki:So, um, so we committed to just focus on, on Utah, and that's where I mean we eat, breathe, sleep this every day, when I'm not working, I'm I'm judging a hash contest in California or or finding new, new cultivars, new strains, new products in other markets, and um, so I think there's, there's definitely room in the next couple of years to grow and really take advantage of what I know in my experience. But it's also, it's all timing, Like the market is the market and like other people not in cannabis have had great ideas and the market just wasn't ready for it, and so I think a lot of it is just it's just timing.
Erik Nilsson:And I think there's a lot of good tailwinds going on right now too, cause everyone, I mean, is deciding they want to be sober, which is, for whatever reason, good for them. I mean, there's a lot of reasons to.
Bijan Sakaki:And there's levels of sobriety. Yes, you know, there's Cali sober, that's what I was going to say is.
Erik Nilsson:I feel like most of my friends that say they're like sober, meaning they're not drinking but they're usually from alcohol. Yeah, yeah, it's mostly for alcohol because like the health curious, because I think it's gonna threaten a lot of social structure. But then also I mean alcohol is not gonna go down without a fight no, and one and one's a medicine and one's a vice.
Bijan Sakaki:Yes, you know, and granted, there's recreational states so people can challenge that and say cannabis can be a vice, but right now, for our market, it's medical and this is the first time that cannabis use has surpassed alcohol use, like nationally, which is crazy.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah, it's this whole inflection point.
Bijan Sakaki:And you look at it Growing up, I can't drink. I did drink for a while, but with my condition, my body would be like what are you doing to me? And it took me some years to figure out. Like you said, there's going to be some weird social isms where, if people aren't drinking, what are they going to go to? And rather than using this as social lubricant, it's like like how many people were drinking to alleviate some of their symptoms yeah pain, mild pain, chronic pain, ptsd, sleep.
Bijan Sakaki:You know all these other things. So I am curious to see where that shift comes. And look when I, when I was experimenting and learning, like I didn't have stores with pharmacies and government testing and so it's a different world. So I think we're in a very lucky place as patients, as citizens of utah and as operators. Like this is like. This is crazy we're growing cannabis in utah where it would never have happened 10 years ago oh yeah, you'd be in like prison for like a decade, yeah it'd be.
Bijan Sakaki:I mean, there's still people. There's still people in prison for this, which is crazy.
Erik Nilsson:And it's also I mean there's also like a detail that a lot of people don't know about that I mean puts it in favor ahead of alcohol, especially in Utah, is, I mean like the LDS church has come out and said if it's a medical prescribed from a doctor, then you can still, I mean, be a full faith member, still, I mean go to the temple and so like there.
Bijan Sakaki:That I think that definitely made the path to getting into the program a lot more acceptable, because there's people that I know that are active members, bishops, et cetera, that like they're like dude, I'm not taking Ad're. Like dude, I'm not taking adderall, I'm not taking ambient anymore and this works for me. Yeah, and I and I was like I, I love you either way, I know you're not going to hell for it so, so I I think if, if that didn't happen, I think we'd be we'd be very bifurcated.
Bijan Sakaki:You know the the a lot of the people here would say I, I need this, but it's frowned upon. So I'm going to continue with these opioids that my doctor has prescribed to me.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah, cause there's just again like there's not a stigma around it and like that's always. The funny thing too is yeah, I mean just like the pill culture in general, to say you know, there's another option.
Bijan Sakaki:Yeah, and what's different too is like, as a pharmaceutical company, let's say no one's. No one's ever saying like, oh, I tried this lorazepam, it's awesome. You know I tried this and this, and so it's it's. It's. It's different, you know, like it's not a apples to apples to acetaminophen or hydrocodone. You know, a lot of times we'll find our pharmacists will advise patients to use them in conjunction. So if you're taking an opioid, lower the use. The intent is to get off the opioid. Lower the use. Cannabis will amplify the impact of it. So how do we slowly get people off that? But again, everyone's metabolism is different. We have an endocannabinoid system in our body which makes it really weird. Like that's where the thc and the cbd gets processed. So people think if we didn't have that system, were we not designed to consume this? You know, like that's like chicken or the egg type question.
Bijan Sakaki:But it definitely wouldn't get the attention it has for sure and and I think the thing you asked something earlier about, like from medical moving forward, I mean, we are the only state that requires a pharmacist at all times and you know, next time you come through we'll sit you down with with our pharmacists. But they're real pharmacists, they're not just stoners in lab coats, it's a. It's a real thing. And there's certain contraindicators where, if you're on one or two medications, we need to know, because cannabis can can impact that. But for the general population it's like it will make you operate at an optimized level. It's just finding the right fit for you.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah, I mean it's the same thing that someone who's diagnosed with ADHD would go to the doctor for and be like, well, if this is how you're feeling, then we'll start with this and we'll see how it goes. And if it feels like everything's I mean the outcomes that you want to have are happening, then great, but if not, let's try something similar and slowly like narrow down this, like pendulum swing that you start with and again like the like there's so much more attention on it now, there's so much research being done, there's so much um, I mean, social stigma is being wiped away. It's hard to not see kind of the path for it all, even in a state like Utah, because when I lived in Seattle I was like there's no way Utah is going intentionally, with the right people behind it, like good operators you don't have to worry about a lot of the questionable things that happen in other states Like in other states.
Bijan Sakaki:Right now you have backdoor. I mean, 80% of California's cannabis goes around the country, yeah, and we don't have that here, you know. So, like we're we're, we're in a good place, we can learn from the people around us, but I think that it's super important to not make the same mistakes that everybody else does too.
Erik Nilsson:Oh well, cause I always remember when I first went to my first appointment he was like I mean, it's so funny, cause like I go and he's like, so most people say this like would you say? He's like, yeah, actually I do have like neck, like chronic neck pain. He's like cool, what else? And just kind of goes through it. And then he's the one who told me about like lds church stuff. He's the one who told me, uh, what else he told me about? But it's just so interesting this was.
Erik Nilsson:This is where you got your card right yeah, yeah, and it was so interesting to go through the process because I mean in seattle there is no, I mean it's recreational. So you show up, yeah, just show up, and you do your thing. And to go from like buying cannabis, from like my friend's older brother's friend, and being all sketched out and trying to like anyway, it's like this whole process we're in seattle, there's a.
Bijan Sakaki:There was a really dope spot, diego pellet pelletier. If you ever shopped there, that was a dope spot in seattle was that the like um?
Bijan Sakaki:it was super fancy yeah almost like like a hipster cocktail bar. Yeah, like vibe, like people had twisty mustaches and three-piece suits. Um, now, seattle, dude, seattle, washington everyone sleeps on washington, but they did it before everybody. Washington, colorado like we all can learn a lot from, and, uh, like you said, the stigma there was removed. You go to colorado or washington, people are growing in their backyard. Yeah, like if you grew in your backyard here, you'd have police here, you know, asap, asap. So, um, I think the one thing that I really appreciate about our marketplace is so in california, there's the bureau of cannabis control, the bcc, and it's huge california's giant. Yeah, you have so many operators it's really difficult to uh get face time with the regulators. You know and I think here because this program was in its infancy, when it went live that there's a pretty good line of communication between legislators, regulators and operators. To be like yo, this, this is why I don't think this is a good idea for these reasons.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah, instead of never being able to even get that because of the way that the infrastructure set um, yeah, and I and I'm glad we kind of started narrow in the approach because again, like if we had to, something terribly wrong happened in the um, like this program, and they had to like reel it in, not saying anything like that ever happened, but if they did roll it out so much more broader, faster a lot more, a lot can go wrong yeah, like, like, if you've like again, these are this is a department that was regulating food and agriculture, and then now you're inspecting live cannabis plants.
Bijan Sakaki:You don't know what to look for, yeah, and so imagine, instead of having eight people and you had 30, like there's a lot more room for error at that point. So I think with anything, as you expand any program, you need to do it intentionally, do it right, make sure it's demand driven, make sure it's with the right people and make it like, make it an equitable thing for everybody. Like, make sure it's right for patients, make sure it's right for operators, instead of just what we deal with in our industry is a lot of like oh, this person didn't get this, so I'm going to go complain and talk to legislators or do this and do that. So a lot of it is like how much of it really is an issue? Or is it one person saying you know stomping?
Erik Nilsson:their feet saying Just the loudest squeaky wheel, exactly, exactly.
Bijan Sakaki:And that's why I appreciate like I'm a patient first and then I'm a business owner, so it's easy for me to put that hat on and be like and then I'm a business owner, so it's easy for me to put that hat on and be like I agree. Or this is obviously a bias from you. Yeah, using this, using like patients as a Trojan horse.
Erik Nilsson:Totally and like the easiest comparison I can derive from is I mean the DABC in Utah, where I can't remember the staff to fact check myself, but it's the DABS now Sorry, dbs Cause I always think dabs Um yeah, well cause DAB DC was a beverage control and now it's services.
Erik Nilsson:Yes, there we go, less controlling less, controlling more, servicing, and where's like they had their first drinker or someone that actually drank alcohol on the board for the. It was either the first time ever or the first time in like recently, like very recent, like, um, in a long time, and so it's nice to hear people like you that it's like oh, I am a patient and a business owner. I'm not just a person looking at the financials and making sure I'm making money, but I'm also not a regulator and so.
Bijan Sakaki:So we have the uh like policy advisory boards that they're not legislative groups but it's a policy board that regulators sit on a couple people from industry, one from law enforcement, one from the patients group. So they try to get like a pretty holistic grab of like non-biased people and we'll come and we'll talk in public comment and give, give our two cents there. But, um, to your point, yes, like we are vocal, we are active and I appreciate the state's willingness to listen. Nothing's perfect. There's always shit that happens. That necessarily like, how did that happen, you know?
Bijan Sakaki:And so my, my biggest thing is how do you do you spend most of your time worrying about that? Or are you head down just trying to master your craft and, you know, sharpen your sword? And that's mostly where I'm at is there's a million things that, yes, I could try and help and do this and that, but, first and foremost, if I don't have a business, I'm not even part of the program. So a lot of it's just been head down and and I do think we're one of the few groups like we're we're one of the only locally owned and operated groups, meaning all my business partners, our investment money, this is all utah and I'm in the store or the grow or the lab every day, and when I'm not in there, I'm, I'm testing, I'm, I'm trying and so it's it. It's not, you know. You hear people everyone has fucking haters. You hear people like oh, you got lucky, or this is like an overnight thing.
Bijan Sakaki:I'm like no, this has been, this has been a lifelong journey, and I'm not, we're not even done. I have no idea where, where the market's going to go, where the program's going to go, where even cannabis is going to go. You know, like this has evolved so much in five years, like what's going to happen in five more years.
Erik Nilsson:Who knows? It could disappear, it could go to the moon. No one ever does.
Bijan Sakaki:And you've got to be ready. You've got to look at both and be ready.
Erik Nilsson:No, I totally agree, and I mean so whenever you're not. I mean working in cannabis um testing cannabis. What else do you like to do in your spare time?
Bijan Sakaki:or get out, enjoy honestly, I'm trying to figure that out like no, I mean that's.
Bijan Sakaki:There's a lot of people yeah, I'm trying to figure that out. I've had some really close friends, like what brings you joy, and the biggest thing that brings me joy is helping people. So I'm trying to figure out how can I do that in a way that I can also, like, do other shit. Um, I hike a lot, um, I, I really, I really think that okay. So I'm doing this, this crazy thing, for on sunday, tomorrow, I'm doing a darkness retreat for four days, uh, where, going to a essentially like a cave, like a underground in this room, and I'll be there for four days and one of my biggest goals is to figure that out. And it's not like I need to say it out loud, I got to go sit in the hole for four days to figure that out, but there's so much noise in the world.
Bijan Sakaki:There's so much noise, but think about it Like there's. So we have 50 employees and every day there's always something and I and I have, I have parents, I have friends, I have cats, so like there's a lot of noise. Yeah, I've, yeah, I've never been able to like. Yes, I meditate, but this experience I'm really looking forward to just seeing like what comes up for me. You know there's, this is me with me, yeah, and I know me like well and I so I'm not like nervous to go into this, I'm just curious to know my biggest thing was like what? What brings me joy?
Bijan Sakaki:yeah what do I like? I like to do, because I don't. I really don't do a lot besides this. Yeah, so long answer for your short question.
Erik Nilsson:No, it's a good because, like there's so many people I've talked to recently we were kind of talking about it before we started recording but I've just had so many conversations in the past I mean, let's say, like year to date, the past 10 months where so many people are saying I have been following what everybody told me to do. I listen to all these external advice, expectations, social pressures.
Bijan Sakaki:And they never worked.
Erik Nilsson:It got me to this point. It's not as good as I thought it was going to be. I don't know who I am, I don't know what I like, I don't know what I want to do. People are like, oh, you have a midlife crisis. I'm like, yeah, but midlife crisis is like, oh, my life's almost over, I'm going to die.
Erik Nilsson:This is almost like an existential crisis of I don't know who I am or what I want to be, and thankfully, that's a question that I've been able to answer really well recently and it's taken a lot of steps and directions that I never thought I would. And what is I mean? I'm not going to flip the script on you, but what is that answer? No, I mean, that's so funny. You should ask Um, I would say one is it's always going to involve other people. I've never heard of anybody being happy or being successful by doing everything themselves or relying on their own doing but that, but that there's a step before that, which comes to knowing who you are, what you want, what makes you happy and finding your values, so to speak. And I remember when I first started, it was after my faith crisis and I was going through therapy to try to figure out who I am.
Bijan Sakaki:What's going?
Erik Nilsson:on Circa, when Circa 2019.
Bijan Sakaki:Okay.
Erik Nilsson:And so a lot of it. Well, I remember my therapist. She gave me this sheet of paper that had like 400 values on it and just said every day, cross five off and little by little, like ones you don't agree with.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah, like that's like. Yeah, that's not me, that's not me, this doesn't matter to me. And came down to um, and I've, I've, like I'm like scratching off here today, like this is like I get it, but like what's going on? And then I mean came down to it where I mean a lot of my values come from connection. I like to know what makes people tick. I love hearing stories. I mean I could talk to anybody about anything for as long as they want to. I mean to the point where I started my own podcast. I think there has to be an element of creativity to it. So I think, as humans, we were born to do things with our hands. None of us were born or we were evolved to a point where we're just, I mean, sitting and looking at a black mirror all day, looking at marketing reports, like that's nothing we were meant to do.
Bijan Sakaki:Or worrying about your taxes all day long. I know.
Erik Nilsson:And so I think there's a part of it for creative and that was one of the first things that I explored is, which is a whole nother thing, Because if you go to anybody and say, are you creative, they will say no, I don't. I can't paint, I can't draw, I can't do anything. But that's two things. That's one, that's their ego telling them that this is who you are, Don't do this Um, and part of if you've been following everything that's led you to your ego to believe that you're this person and you know it's not this, why would you keep listening to all of that and not branch out? So there's always going to be this element of exploring, especially exploring things that are against your ego, that you would say this is me, this is who I am, this is what I stand for.
Bijan Sakaki:Stand for is a different thing, but of like this is who I think I am.
Erik Nilsson:This is who I think I challenge it Cause again like I couldn't have picked up a paintbrush and painted anything. But I knew that there was some creativity in me that needed to get expressed and I was like this would be a fun way to do it. A friend of mine got me a 10-week painting course downtown and I remember showing up to the first class like I'm not good at this, I can't do this, this isn't me. And then I'll never forget that we were working on this one painting of an apple and I was like again my negative self-talk was going in there. My ego was talking like this is stupid, you're bad at this. This is so like what are you doing? And someone walked behind me in the class like oh, that's actually really good. And in my head I'm like shut up, like you don't know what you're talking about. This is terrible. And I took a picture of it, went home and then looked at the picture.
Erik Nilsson:I was like that is pretty great, I can do this which is another thing, is so once you can learn that older generations, but it's less relevant now that we cannot learn new things, we cannot become new people. We cannot change the course of anything.
Bijan Sakaki:You are what you are. This is the hand you're dealt.
Erik Nilsson:You can't teach an old dog new tricks. But in reality, when we learn that there's something that I did, that I enjoy, that I haven't done, that I can get better at all of a sudden this door starts to creep open. But then not only that. Um, there's something else I think I was talking to Scott Paul about actually is about the barrier to competence has never been lower. Like, if I mean, for the example of the podcast, I don't know how to edit audio. I didn't know how to post a YouTube video. I didn't know how to upload a podcast to the website. I didn't know how to SEO.
Erik Nilsson:I don't know how to build a website, I didn't know how to create social media posts Like I need to learn. Or go to chat GBT and say, teach me how to do this, but like there's the barriers never been lowered to get to competent. Now, master's a whole different thing, but you don't need to be a master to start doing something. So things like I mean painting video games, getting in shit, like whatever it could be, it's never been easier to try. And so again, like I always tell people go towards creativity, challenge. And so again, like I always tell people, go towards creativity, challenge your ego and then be I mean yourself. And like you'll start to learn who it is. Like there's a book I'm reading right now that even in the prologue it talks about how this book will either be the biggest waste of time in your life or change your life.
Bijan Sakaki:What's the?
Erik Nilsson:book the New Earth by Eckhart Tolle, okay, and it was like a book that spoke to my soul. I read the first chapter. I was like this is why it just felt like it was just written for me, and he kind of talks about how it takes an amount of presence and awareness to do so. But in a situation, why am I doing this? Am I doing this because I'm expecting some sort of social value? Am I doing this because it makes my mom happy, my friends happy? Some sort of social value, am I doing this because it makes my mom happy, my friends happy is what someone would want me to do in this moment. Or is this something because I actually want to do it? And so I think that's a part of things is like you have to be present and aware enough to know what's going on in a moment, cause so many people are just so oblivious and just kind of do whatever they do and don't think about why they do it.
Bijan Sakaki:I mean, those are, those are all on point I. I think the one thing I would add to that from my perspective is trust your decisions, like trust your intuition a lot decisiveness and you're not gonna do it, you're not gonna know it until you do it.
Bijan Sakaki:It's like. It's like how do you expect to know what the best move would be if you haven't taken those risks and known like okay, when I get this feeling and I do do this, how was the outcome? Okay, I'll listen to that little voice inside of me, or that pendulum in my stomach, and so if you can figure that out, then then then I think the relationship with you becomes so much better.
Erik Nilsson:And that's when the snowball starts. Yeah, because then, when you have this relationship with yourself and you understand that whole aspect of things, then you can come back and say, oh, this is who I am, this is who I'm good to be, and make decisions based on that. And all of a sudden you were performing as your authentic self, not as what someone would expect you to be, and you can have better outcomes because you're already good at it, because it's part of who you are. And then you start to see this confidence come forth in who yourself. So you're already good at it, because it's part of who you are and then you start to see this confidence come forth in who you're yourself. So you're more confident being yourself. And the more confident you are in being yourself, the more you surround yourself with the right people for you, and you start to build this world that you didn't even believe. And it all comes down with what do you stand for, what are your values? What motivates you?
Bijan Sakaki:And that, for me, is a huge litmus test on who I want to work with, who I want to be around, because the more people that are working on that relationship, it's like, oh wow, I really want to fuck with you because you're pushing yourself, you're leveling yourself up. What am I going to learn from that? And vice versa, what can I teach you? And so I think a big thing for me has been like, in order to get to where I wanted to be, mentally, spiritually, physically, emotionally like crabs in a barrel dude Crabs they will bring you down. Like crabs in a barrel dude crabs they they will bring you down. So, finding the right people that will help elevate you in those moments, to get you there, and I think, having like I'm very fortunate that my business partners are my mentors, are my friends, you know, like I don't have to worry about is this person giving me advice because they want to buy a Ferrari or they think they want to reinvent themselves to be this cool person.
Bijan Sakaki:It's like no, this, we know who we are, we're authentic, we're honest, we're genuine. These are our core values and like I'm I'm I'm a Buddhist and I don't I don't really fuck with religion, but I, but I recognize how people treat people. It doesn't matter what you believe, it's like how you see the world and how you treat people. And it all comes down to your core values. And if you don't know who you are and you don't know what those values are, that's great because you can figure that out, but it's also scary because someone that doesn't know that like collateral damage. You know, like, like it. It's hard. It's hard to be fully ingrained in that like uh. But it's also good to be an example, lead by like, lead by example but I mean good luck.
Erik Nilsson:I'm excited to see how it goes. It sounds like quite the experience yeah, it's been, it's good.
Bijan Sakaki:I'm super grateful. Whatever happens happens. You know everyone thinks, myself included. Okay, once you do this thing, everything's fixed.
Erik Nilsson:It's like no dude. No, that just draws the map. Now you have to go follow it.
Bijan Sakaki:For sure, and you know heavy is the head that wears the crown and you got to realize that, like there is a lot of responsibility to be a leader, you have to have your shit on point and no one's perfect, but I'm always, every day, trying to be better than I was yesterday.
Bijan Sakaki:Because I tell all my employees look, if you're not using this as a way to level up and you're just using this as a short to level up and you're just using this as a short-term job, like, go find another job. Because the most meaningful interactions I've had have been at the places, like the tech job that I thought when am I ever going to learn this? When is this ever going to be applicable in my life? And now that I'm running my own company, I'm like wow, you're actually absolutely right. This, this was the biggest lesson. I got to learn this on other people's dollar. Now I learn it on my own dollar.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah, it's a lot more expensive these days.
Bijan Sakaki:And so I tell people I'm like look, learn on my dollar right now, like trust me. I don't know a lot, really, but I know what I know, so trust me and I will help you guys level up and in return, we'll be able to help a lot of people and in return, we'll make the money that we need to out of it. That's not the driving force and I'm learning that money is energy. So many people put so much focus on that, over relationships and treating people well. It's like at all costs to get this thing and it's like that's the last. That's, that's a renewable resource. Yeah, your health, relationships, your friends those are not renewable. And you know all, all all you can do is be authentic. And I think I, I, I live that. I know I live that. I don't think I do that.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah, there you go.
Bijan Sakaki:My company is Beehive Pharmacy. Yes, so we have a medical cannabis pharmacy in Brigham City and in Salt Lake City, right off the 201. We have a boutique grow grows craft cannabis in Ogden, so it's crazy to think that all of this is here in our backyard. But uh, yeah, it's here. We'd love to to get you guys in the program. Anyone that doesn't have a medical card, reach out. We do events. Um, we'd love to help you guys get in the program.
Erik Nilsson:What's the best place to find information about that?
Bijan Sakaki:Best information would be uhivepharmacycom. Find us on social media. We do an email newsletter. I was doing the Instagram for a little bit, which again is not my strong suit, so I've got somebody taking over that Delegation. Yes, so we've got the website, the social media, and those will be the two best places to figure out when we're doing events to get people in cool. But our four-year anniversary is october 18th, which is nuts. I mean four years in this is like 10 20 in another industry.
Erik Nilsson:So still drinking from the firehose yeah, there's still. Yeah, it's, it's nuts and, lastly, if you would have someone on the small lake city podcast to hear more about what they're up to, who would you want to hear from?
Bijan Sakaki:have you done, scott, yet? Okay, um, have you got jim morse on here? Jim is one of the most interesting humans that I've met. He yeah, I'll connect you. He used to do a lot of real estate. He runs Skinwalker Ranch now.
Erik Nilsson:Oh, okay, yeah.
Bijan Sakaki:Yeah, jim is probably the most interesting man that I've met in Salt Lake.
Erik Nilsson:Then I'm already excited.
Bijan Sakaki:So yeah, I'll connect you guys.
Erik Nilsson:Okay, well, you're good to sit down and hear your story, yeah. Talk more about Beehive, excited for what's to come with it thank you for the opportunity.
Bijan Sakaki:I appreciate you and, uh, I hope, uh, I hope this this was good. I hope you got to see what we have to offer and this thing really works now yeah, go to beehive they will take care of you, you'll get all your hopes and dreams.
Erik Nilsson:And illnesses, ailments, ailments, ailments, ailments. Yes, so we're doing it. We're doing a two-day car drive, the 17th and the 18th of october, james and Yannis's ailments, ailments, ailments, ailments Six.
Bijan Sakaki:Yes, so we're doing a two-day car drive, the 17th and the 18th of October. We're doing those for 50 bucks, and then our four-year anniversary is on the 18th as well. So normally it's not that cheap and we normally don't do two in a week, but hey, we're turning four.
Erik Nilsson:Yeah so.
